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Senate Bill 310 - Rollback of renewable energy standards

Home Forums General Columbus Discussion Politics Senate Bill 310 – Rollback of renewable energy standards

Viewing 12 posts - 1 through 12 (of 12 total)
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  • #1019957

    SteveKZ087
    Participant

    Apparently the governor is prepared to sign the legislation passed by the senate and house that would make Ohio the first state (of the 29 with renewable energy standards) to actually reduce renewable energy standards, and eliminate renewable energy credits / tax incentives.

    What an absolute joke.

    I’m inclined to agree with Rep. Robert Hagan, D-Youngstown, who says that this ‘distinction’ makes us the “laughingstock of these United States.” As a transplant to Ohio who has lived here just over one year, this is beyond disappointing. I had hoped that our state government had better priorities than wasting the people’s time by rolling back the clock.

    http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/business/2014/05/28/green-energy-bill-revamp-passes-ohio-house.html

    #1019988

    Scioto Tower
    Participant

    The utilities are forced to buy energy from sources that are not the cheapest and reap huge subsidies. On top of that, the renewable energy standards were instituted before the US realized it had a large cache of natural gas, which is not renewable, but is much cleaner burning than coal. What’s wrong with hitting the pause button? You greenies want your green, you want it now, and you don’t care how much the rest of us have to pay for it. Instead of worrying about Ohio being a laughingstock, why don’t you find a way to force the likes of China, India, etc. to clean up their air. You realize we all share it, correct? So, we “green up” here w/o worrying about the cost, while they continue to spew pure soot into the air in those countries. I am all for cleaner sources of energy, but you can’t sacrifice your economy to get there.

    #1020000
    Coremodels
    Coremodels
    Participant
    #1020003

    Scioto Tower
    Participant

    Is that why they wear masks in the big cities in China?

    #1020004
    Coremodels
    Coremodels
    Participant

    Clearly I can’t win an argument against someone who saw a photo on the internet somewhere…I surrender.

    #1020044

    Aaron Marshall
    Participant

    The utilities are forced to buy energy from sources that are not the cheapest and reap huge subsidies. On top of that, the renewable energy standards were instituted before the US realized it had a large cache of natural gas, which is not renewable, but is much cleaner burning than coal. What’s wrong with hitting the pause button? You greenies want your green, you want it now, and you don’t care how much the rest of us have to pay for it. Instead of worrying about Ohio being a laughingstock, why don’t you find a way to force the likes of China, India, etc. to clean up their air. You realize we all share it, correct? So, we “green up” here w/o worrying about the cost, while they continue to spew pure soot into the air in those countries. I am all for cleaner sources of energy, but you can’t sacrifice your economy to get there.

    There are so many things wrong here it’s hard to to know where to start. Here’s two biggies:

    1.) This law that was frozen by SB 310 was reworked in 2012. Since then the only things that have changed in the energy market is that natural gas prices have doubled and renewables have gotten cheaper.

    2.) Consumers see a substantial benefit from energy efficiency standards. They save utility customers (you and me and everyone else) big money. For example, AEP reported in a filing with the PUCO that customers would save $1.5 billion from 2015-2019 from energy efficiency they had to do under the now-frozen standards. Now they have to do 0.
    So who is losing out exactly? Oh yeah, everyone.

    #1020061

    gramarye
    Participant

    <div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Scioto Tower wrote:</div>
    The utilities are forced to buy energy from sources that are not the cheapest and reap huge subsidies. On top of that, the renewable energy standards were instituted before the US realized it had a large cache of natural gas, which is not renewable, but is much cleaner burning than coal. What’s wrong with hitting the pause button? You greenies want your green, you want it now, and you don’t care how much the rest of us have to pay for it. Instead of worrying about Ohio being a laughingstock, why don’t you find a way to force the likes of China, India, etc. to clean up their air. You realize we all share it, correct? So, we “green up” here w/o worrying about the cost, while they continue to spew pure soot into the air in those countries. I am all for cleaner sources of energy, but you can’t sacrifice your economy to get there.

    There are so many things wrong here it’s hard to to know where to start. Here’s two biggies:

    1.) This law that was frozen by SB 310 was reworked in 2012. Since then the only things that have changed in the energy market is that natural gas prices have doubled and renewables have gotten cheaper.

    If this is the case, then there’s no need for the law requiring utilities to use more renewables; they’ll do that on their own if renewables get cheaper and conventional sources get more expensive.

    2.) Consumers see a substantial benefit from energy efficiency standards. They save utility customers (you and me and everyone else) big money. For example, AEP reported in a filing with the PUCO that customers would save $1.5 billion from 2015-2019 from energy efficiency they had to do under the now-frozen standards. Now they have to do 0.<br>
    So who is losing out exactly? Oh yeah, everyone.

    Source?

    #1020193

    Aaron Marshall
    Participant

    <div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Aaron Marshall wrote:</div>

    <div class=”d4p-bbt-quote-title”>Scioto Tower wrote:</div><br>
    The utilities are forced to buy energy from sources that are not the cheapest and reap huge subsidies. On top of that, the renewable energy standards were instituted before the US realized it had a large cache of natural gas, which is not renewable, but is much cleaner burning than coal. What’s wrong with hitting the pause button? You greenies want your green, you want it now, and you don’t care how much the rest of us have to pay for it. Instead of worrying about Ohio being a laughingstock, why don’t you find a way to force the likes of China, India, etc. to clean up their air. You realize we all share it, correct? So, we “green up” here w/o worrying about the cost, while they continue to spew pure soot into the air in those countries. I am all for cleaner sources of energy, but you can’t sacrifice your economy to get there.

    There are so many things wrong here it’s hard to to know where to start. Here’s two biggies:

    1.) This law that was frozen by SB 310 was reworked in 2012. Since then the only things that have changed in the energy market is that natural gas prices have doubled and renewables have gotten cheaper.

    If this is the case, then there’s no need for the law requiring utilities to use more renewables; they’ll do that on their own if renewables get cheaper and conventional sources get more expensive.

    2.) Consumers see a substantial benefit from energy efficiency standards. They save utility customers (you and me and everyone else) big money. For example, AEP reported in a filing with the PUCO that customers would save $1.5 billion from 2015-2019 from energy efficiency they had to do under the now-frozen standards. Now they have to do 0.<br><br>
    So who is losing out exactly? Oh yeah, everyone.

    Source?

    Paging Adam Smith, please report to this Internet discussion.
    Ah yes, the invisible hand of the market argument. Sadly, the world has changed since 1759 and we have some new models confronting us. Like, for example, the modern utility company.
    The reason why Mr. Smith’s marketplace theory doesn’t work here is because the energy market isn’t a classic, arms length marketplace. AEP and First Energy and others in Ohio own coal-fired power plants that are part of the market.
    Thus they have an incentive to buy the energy from their own generating facilities, not the cheapest…
    But wait…wouldn’t that cut into their profits?
    No, they are guaranteed a markup on whatever energy they transmit to their customers. So they don’t care about getting the lowest cost energy as long as the utility regulators (the historically bumbling PUCO) don’t call them on it. They would rather pay a little more and buy from themselves.

    Relying on economic theory from 1759 doesn’t always work in 2014.

    I cant link from this device I’m on but the AEP energy efficiency savings estimate comes from the April 9 Ohio Senate Public Utilities committee testimony on SB 310 of Trish Demeter of OEC. The testimony quotes directly from AEP docs.

    #1021571
    Coremodels
    Coremodels
    Participant

    http://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2014/06/04/51-businesses-21-organizations-in-letter-to-kasich.html?ana=twt

    51 businesses, 21 organizations in letter to Kasich: S.B. 310 will be harmful to Ohioans’ electric bills, burgeoning renewable industries

    A group of more than 70 manufacturers and organizations, including Honda of America Manufacturing Inc. and Whirlpool Corp., are pleading with Ohio Gov. John Kasich to reduce the effects of freezing the state’s 2008 renewables and energy efficiency initiative.
    The appeal comes months after some big Ohio producers, including Honda (NYSE:HMC) and Honeywell International Inc. (NYSE:HON), urged state Senate President Keith Faber, R-Celina, to spare the energy efficiency requirements from a legislative-inspired freeze.

    #1022216

    joev
    Participant

    This is awesome. Kasich is sunk if he chooses coal companies over modern manufacturers.

    #1060735

    News
    Participant

    Freeze On Energy Standards Hurting Central Ohio Solar Business
    January 26, 2015
    by Debbie Holmes
    89.7 NPR News Morning Host

    A Central Ohio solar company is blaming Ohio’s freeze on green energy standards for some of the slowdown in its business. Recently a study from research group Pew Charitable Trusts’ Clean Energy Initiative found that the 2 year freeze on mandated renewable or alternative energy sources has led to sharp drops in business for the wind and solar industry in Ohio.

    READ MORE: http://wosu.org/2012/news/2015/01/26/freeze-energy-standards-hurting-central-ohio-solar-business/

    #1060854

    gramarye
    Participant

    It isn’t just the freeze in renewable standards, though. It’s the collapse in conventional energy prices from both coal and gas. The urgency of increasing PV buildout is much less than it was two years ago, and we (royal “we,” not necessarily Solar Vision specifically) can afford to take more time for the technology to mature. Ultimately, solar is going to rule the roost; the price per installed PV kWh is still dropping and there is every reason to expect that it will ultimately reach parity with conventional sources even at their currently deflated prices. But its time is still likely several years off, maybe even a decade or more.

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