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Proposal to Reroute some COTA Buses from High Street to Front Street

Home Forums General Columbus Discussion Transportation Proposal to Reroute some COTA Buses from High Street to Front Street

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Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 107 total)
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  • #462796

    wynnie
    Member

    I agree that this proposal is racist and has little to do with parking. One only needs to look at the reader comments on the Dispatch web site to confirm that this issue is about getting the “undesirables” off High Street. When they comment, “The people have no business even being downtown, only there to live off government programs. There is constant drug dealing going on and yes, most of the riders look like complete thugs.”

    This is overt Jim Crow-style discrimination. No group of people are “FILTHY MAGGOTS.”

    Also, aren’t the High Street line-ups in front of the Statehouse (northbound) and COTA headquarters (southbound)? Isn’t business doing well there? I don’t see any empty storefronts in those line-up locations. However, I do agree that idle times could be shortened.

    #462797
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    wynnie said:
    One only needs to look at the reader comments on the Dispatch web site to confirm that this issue is about getting the “undesirables” off High Street.

    The Dispatch commentators are hardly an accurate sample size for measuring anything. Please don’t bring their bigoted comments over here, because no one here is saying anything like that. We’re trying to have a more thoughtful and productive conversation here.

    wynnie said:
    Also, aren’t the High Street line-ups in front of the Statehouse (northbound) and COTA headquarters (southbound)? Isn’t business doing well there? I don’t see any empty storefronts in those line-up locations. However, I do agree that idle times could be shortened.

    Northbound in front of the Statehouse = The statehouse. There’s no retail there.

    Southbound in front of COTA HQ includes multiple vacant retail spaces, and others that are underutilized.

    Retail is more vibrant on High Street in the Short North and German Village / Brewery District where there is on-street metered parking on High. It suffers through all of Downtown where there is none.

    #462798

    wynnie
    Member

    I’m just saying that there are a lot of closed-minded people out there… and that’s reality…Similarly, one may also be bold to assume that most folks on CU are left-leaning (like me)…therefore, it’s hardly an accurate sampling of the “majority opinion.” So, to be fair, somewhere in the middle lies the truth.

    I know that the statehouse has no storefronts, that’s why I wrote it…because the point of line-ups “driving away business” is moot. Also, there are maybe three empty store fronts at the north corner Broad and High, but it’s 75% occupied, which is better than Broad Street, where there are no line-ups.

    We all want to see downtown thriving, but I’m not going to back down in any fashion when I argue that moving routes off of High Street is racially-motivated.

    #462799

    wynnie said:
    I agree that this proposal is racist and has little to do with parking. One only needs to look at the reader comments on the Dispatch web site to confirm that this issue is about getting the “undesirables” off High Street. When they comment, “The people have no business even being downtown, only there to live off government programs. There is constant drug dealing going on and yes, most of the riders look like complete thugs.”

    This is overt Jim Crow-style discrimination. No group of people are “FILTHY MAGGOTS.”

    Also, aren’t the High Street line-ups in front of the Statehouse (northbound) and COTA headquarters (southbound)? Isn’t business doing well there? I don’t see any empty storefronts in those line-up locations. However, I do agree that idle times could be shortened.

    Wynnie, although this first move brings the #1 off of High st, I think once this is tested out, COTA will bring more busses off of High. Bringing metered parking onto High and therefore retail, will offer COTA passengers of all ethnicities more products and services for them to enjoy along their commuting experience. This also has the potential to provide minority owned business a chance to launch their business Downtown. Think of the amount of jobs this can bring for #1 riders who rely on jobs along the route or Downtown. Although it seems harsh that they are wanting to take the #1 to Front st as the first test, it has the best rerouting plan and seems ideal.

    I personally avoid the Dispatch Comment section because there are often classist and racist statements there. I don’t think those statements reflect the majority of the way people in our society feel or even COTA for that matter.

    #462800
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    wynnie said:
    I’m just saying that there are a lot of closed-minded people out there… and that’s reality…Similarly, one may also be bold to assume that most folks on CU are left-leaning (like me)…therefore, it’s hardly an accurate sampling of the “majority opinion.” So, to be fair, somewhere in the middle lies the truth.

    But the general public is not proposing this idea. It’s something that was originally announced during the development of the 2010 Downtown Development plan, and the effort is being spearheaded by COTA, The City of Columbus, The SID and a few other related organizations. If you’re claiming it’s racially-charged, then you should be reviewing the information presented by those groups, and not the kneejerk reactions of the general public in any capacity.

    There could be a news story proclaiming that the sky is blue and there would be racist remarks from idiots in the world… but that doesn’t mean the sky is a racist.

    wynnie said:
    I know that the statehouse has no storefronts, that’s why I wrote it…because the point of line-ups “driving away business” is moot. Also, there are maybe three empty store fronts at the north corner Broad and High, but it’s 75% occupied, which is better than Broad Street, where there are no line-ups.

    Broad Street has a whole different set of problems related to retail development. Simply put, there’s no easy one-step fix. I stated earlier that rerouting buses isn’t even the main issue in my opinion, the lack of public parking on High Street is. But in reality it’s only one of a dozen things that needs to be done to address retail issues Downtown.

    wynnie said:
    We all want to see downtown thriving, but I’m not going to back down in any fashion when I argue that moving routes off of High Street is racially-motivated.

    So you’re going to avoid spending money at the few Downtown businesses who are attempting to make a difference and punish them because some Dispatch commentators make racist comments about a transit proposal?

    Sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense at all.

    #462801

    wynnie
    Member

    Even though we have numerous parking lots and garages downtown, as well as parking along the east-west streets, I’m not adamantly opposed to some parking on High Street. I’m opposed to rerouting because it’s inconvenient, classist, racially-motivated, and costly.

    In the future, I think that there will be some parking along High and near Columbus Commons. But, getting parking in front of government buildings is going to be very difficult. So, I don’t see how rerouting buses is going to make a great impact on downtown development if parking is going to be minimal / scattered.

    It’s just my opinion, but I feel that a lot of people want a sanitized / gentrified downtown, but feel uncomfortable when faced with the realities of city life (one of the elements of a great downtown is diversity).

    #462802
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    wynnie said:
    It’s just my opinion, but I feel that a lot of people want a sanitized / gentrified downtown, but feel uncomfortable when faced with the realities of city life (one of the elements of a great downtown is diversity).

    Well, you’re perfectly entitled to your own opinion.

    But if this move were about “sanitizing” or gentrifying Downtown, then it would be a proposal to eliminate bus routes all together. Shifting one route by a block or two isn’t changing the the demographic makeup of Downtown one bit.

    #462803

    wynnie
    Member

    Walker said:

    So you’re going to avoid spending money at the few Downtown businesses who are attempting to make a difference and punish them because some Dispatch commentators make racist comments about a transit proposal?

    Sorry, but that makes absolutely no sense at all.

    I didn’t say that I wouldn’t spend money downtown. I don’t know where you got that idea from… I work downtown, support downtown businesses, and ride COTA… every weekday. But since you suggested it, boycotting businesses that promote this idea sounds like it could catch on…

    Also, Bob Vitale’s article from the Dispatch suggests that I’m not the only one who thinks that the rerouting idea is discriminatory…the bigoted reader comments only bolster the argument.

    #462804

    wynnie
    Member

    Walker said:
    Well, you’re perfectly entitled to your own opinion.

    But if this move were about “sanitizing” or gentrifying Downtown, then it would be a proposal to eliminate bus routes all together. Shifting one route by a block or two isn’t changing the the demographic makeup of Downtown one bit.

    Lots of ideas have been proposed. And you are entitled to your opinion. :-) I’ll agree to disagree on this one.

    #462805

    jbcmh81
    Participant

    This idea that the bus reroute proposal is racially motivated seems absolutely ridiculous and totally unsupportable by facts. First, most of this city’s leadership, including the mayor and city council, are black. Why would they be motivated by racism? Second, does Columbus have that kind of reputation? I’ve always found it to be very open and accepting outside of a very tiny minority that has had no say in this process to begin with. Third, I agree with Walker in that if the goal was to completely remove minorities from Downtown, the proposal would not simply be suggesting a bus reroute a block or two away. It would be out of Downtown altogether. Fourth, Downtown has one of the lowest crime rates of the urban core neighborhoods, so clearly these bus riders (and the Downtown population of residents and workers as a whole) are generally a non-issue in that regard anyway, so why would that even come up? Honestly, if there is any racism going on, it’s in the thought process that a bunch of city leaders and organizations are getting together to remove blacks from Downtown. It’s 2011 folks. If the race card doesn’t make sense, it’s probably because it’s not about race.

    #462806

    IMHO, rerouting the cars and keeping the buses would be a better option. Possibly getting rid of every-other stop in the areas where it seems like there’s one on every single block – but I don’t see how the buses are a problem.

    The on-street parking in the Short North is irritating (restricted parking hours – that nobody obeys anyway, variable meter time limits/ prices, and greatly reduced visibility for someone turning off a side street), so extending that nightmare from the Convention Center to the Commons would not really help. I much prefer the little pull-off metered lots or garages that get cars off the street in a central enough location that it’s an easy walk to several destinations, with long enough meter limits so you’re not in a huge hairy hurry to eat and run.

    I’d really love to see sections of high street (perhaps from Buttles to Parsons!) go pedestrian/ bus/ bike/ pedicab/ streetcar only. That would be so cool.

    #462807

    cc
    Member

    ohiogirlie74 said:
    I’d really love to see sections of high street (perhaps from Buttles to Parsons!) go pedestrian/ bus/ bike/ pedicab/ streetcar only. That would be so cool.

    I think that was a popular thing to do in the 1970’s as they tried to fix dying downtowns with transit malls. It seemed to just speed up their decline in many places. I remember them removing the transit mall in my hometown in the 1990s.

    #462808

    wynnie
    Member

    It would also benefit downtown if we were to return 3rd and 4th streets to two-way traffic. It would be more appealing to pedestrians and slow down drivers. Plus, we already have on-street parking on those streets. Two-way traffic creates neighborhoods, not exit routes… I think that residents who live along those streets would also appreciate less noise.

    #462809

    cc
    Member

    I would love to see two way conversion of 3rd and 4th.

    #462810

    News
    Participant

    ohiogirlie74 said:
    I much prefer the little pull-off metered lots or garages that get cars off the street in a central enough location that it’s an easy walk to several destinations, with long enough meter limits so you’re not in a huge hairy hurry to eat and run.

    That works for some customers, but not all. If you want to pop into one place quickly, you don’t need a parking lot for longer term parking.

    Also, those metered parking lots in the Short North have the same rules and regulations as the rest of the meters in the neighborhood other than the dozen that are on the I-670 cap.

    One of the more important things that metered parking provides is a buffer between the sidewalk and the traffic. It’s easy to forget about in the Short North, but if it were removed you wouldn’t feel comfortable at all walking down a narrow sidewalk or sitting on a sidewalk patio with cars zooming by at 25mph just inches away from you.

    Currently, that’s the situation Downtown. There’s no buffer from sidewalk to street. It’s noisy and fast moving and unfriendly to pedestrian aesthetics.

Viewing 15 posts - 16 through 30 (of 107 total)

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