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The Sale/Purchase of Nationwide Arena

Home Forums General Columbus Discussion Sports The Sale/Purchase of Nationwide Arena

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  • #340352

    DTown
    Participant

    jbcmh81 said:
    Does anyone have any numbers on the overall economic impact of the arean or the AD, with or without the current financial deal?

    This is from 2008 – Arena District Economic Study

    Lots has changed since then, locally and nationally, but much of it still applies.

    #340353

    Graybeak
    Participant

    DTown said:
    This is from 2008 – Arena District Economic Study

    Lots has changed since then, locally and nationally, but much of it still applies.

    Average annual wages per District employee was $64,655 in 2006, representing
    over $350 million in total District wages in 2006.

    I wonder if that includes the hockey players.

    #340354
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    MRipley said:
    Maybe the majority of its citizens don’t care whether the city has a “big time” image. They might be perfectly fine with a small town atmosphere.

    Want a small town atmosphere? Move to a small town. Columbus is the 15th biggest in the country with a steadily growing population. Not sure why anyone would expect the city to feel any smaller than it is.

    #340355
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    cheap said:
    i seem to remember a place called the brewery district doing the same thing 15 years ago.

    how’s it doing?

    The Brewery District is doing great! Some of the rowdy nightlife is gone, but it’s remained a strong office & residential neighborhood with high property values and high rental rates…

    Welcome Back to The Brewery District

    #340356

    JeepGirl
    Participant

    Walker said:
    Want a small town atmosphere? Move to a small town. Columbus is the 15th biggest in the country with a steadily growing population. Not sure why anyone would expect the city to feel any smaller than it is.

    A large concentrated population with a small town feel right here in Columbus. Nothing wrong with that. Might be that people like it that way. Maybe not you, but you’re not everybody.

    #340357
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    JeepGirl said:
    A large concentrated population with a small town feel right here in Columbus. Nothing wrong with that. Might be that people like it that way. Maybe not you, but you’re not everybody.

    No, nothing wrong with that at all. I certainly like that Columbus has a friendly vibe that is generally more associated with smaller towns than with larger cities where people are bitter and don’t make eye contact with each other.

    But if you want to live in a true small town, move to a place where less than 10,000 people live rather than fight against the changes in Columbus that come with the growth and maturation that a city goes through with an increasing population.

    #340358

    cheap
    Member

    Walker said:
    No, nothing wrong with that at all. I certainly like that Columbus has a friendly vibe that is generally more associated with smaller towns than with larger cities where people are bitter and don’t make eye contact with each other.

    But if you want to live in a true small town, move to a place where less than 10,000 people live rather than fight against the changes in Columbus that come with the growth and maturation that a city goes through with an increasing population.

    all that growth and maturation brought that Polaris mess to Columbus.
    or was it the other way around?

    #340359
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    It was the other way around.

    Polaris maturation brought Columbus all that growth mess to and.

    #340360

    JeepGirl
    Participant

    DTown said:
    This is from 2008 – Arena District Economic Study

    Lots has changed since then, locally and nationally, but much of it still applies.

    The very first sentence in the study footnotes:

    1 The authors did not attempt to estimate how much of the reported local investment and spending would have occurred anyway in other parts of central Ohio had the Arena District not been developed.

    Most economic impact studies are simply tools created to sell someone on something and small print footnote disclaimers such as this are the reason why they aren’t worth the paper they’re written on.

    #340361

    jbcmh81
    Participant

    JeepGirl said:
    The very first sentence in the study footnotes:

    1 The authors did not attempt to estimate how much of the reported local investment and spending would have occurred anyway in other parts of central Ohio had the Arena District not been developed.

    Most economic impact studies are simply tools created to sell someone on something and small print footnote disclaimers such as this are the reason why they aren’t worth the paper they’re written on.

    Really have to disagree here. The AD economic impact can be measured because it exists. Had it never been built, there was no guarantee anything of equal value would’ve been created elsewhere in the city. Trying to disregard current value because it may or may not have come in another form could be applied to literally every single last development, from the suburbs to the urban core. I’d take established value over the nebulous “might’ve been” any day.

    #340362

    JeepGirl
    Participant

    jbcmh81 said:
    Really have to disagree here. The AD economic impact can be measured because it exists. Had it never been built, there was no guarantee anything of equal value would’ve been created elsewhere in the city. Trying to disregard current value because it may or may not have come in another form could be applied to literally every single last development, from the suburbs to the urban core. I’d take established value over the nebulous “might’ve been” any day.

    Sure. Choosing to ignore the fact that even the authors of this document concede that they didn’t consider development which might have occurred anyway without the arena, would be characteristic of those with blinders on. Remember, they put that disclaimer in there for a reason.

    But hey, ride your pony your way… it’s all good.

    #340363

    gramarye
    Participant

    thirstychef said:
    So your Marysville comparison is valid, up to the point of growth potential. Simply because Marysville doesn’ want or have the potential to be a Columbus. Because Columbus has no natural boundaries, it can become as big as it wants to.

    Marysville has no natural boundaries, either. In fact, Columbus’ lack of natural boundaries is an obstacle to dense development, because it’s not geographically necessary the way it is in Manhattan, Seattle, or San Francisco. There is no physical barrier preventing Columbus from sprawling like Houston or Phoenix. The Arena District actually makes use of the artificial barriers of I-670 and OH-315 to keep its size manageable.

    #340364

    gramarye
    Participant

    JeepGirl said:
    Sure. Choosing to ignore the fact that even the authors of this document concede that they didn’t consider development which might have occurred anyway without the arena, would be characteristic of those with blinders on. Remember, they put that disclaimer in there for a reason.

    But hey, ride your pony your way… it’s all good.

    Do you have any reason to believe that the Arena District really took the place of something better that would have gone in that space? Do you realize how long that area lay fallow, decrepit, and dangerous? Others who might have wanted to take a stab at doing something with that area had more than ample opportunity. There were no takers.

    As for the larger crowding-out effect argument, i.e., that developing the Arena District might have crowded out other development elsewhere in Greater Columbus, that’s an economically sound argument because of the public subsidies, I admit–but the city’s total net expenditure (through the date of that study) was $36 million, with a gross expenditure of $67.8 million. That’s not for the arena, it’s for the entire district. Considering what’s happened in that district, I have serious trouble seeing any argument that it wasn’t a reasonable and efficient use of that level of public funds. If we were talking about $678 million, that might be a different story.

    Also, remember that economic decisions need to be made on the margin, i.e., on a going-forward basis from the status quo. That means that the real inquiry at this point is what would lose the city more: letting the arena go bankrupt or purchasing it.

    The Greater Columbus Convention Center nearby is already owned by Franklin County (with a private company contracted as manager). That’s worked out well enough.

    #340365

    DTown
    Participant

    JeepGirl said:
    Sure. Choosing to ignore the fact that even the authors of this document concede that they didn’t consider development which might have occurred anyway without the arena, would be characteristic of those with blinders on. Remember, they put that disclaimer in there for a reason.

    But hey, ride your pony your way… it’s all good.

    I’m not sure I understand what you’re trying to say here. The study was conducted by an independent organization, so it wasn’t at anyone’s behest, nor trying to convince anyone of anything. It simply measured the economic impact of an existing system. It was, I believe, an “academic exercise”.

    Clearly, there are a complete spectrum of possibilities that could have occurred in an alternate universe without an arena, but how could they have been measured?

    Based on what exists now, by most any economic measure, the arena district is a successful product that benefits both the district and the city. If you’re saying that something could have been even better, anyone can argue that anything is possible.

    If you’re saying that the success of the arena district may have come at the expense of other parts of the city, well, there could be some merit to that, as Columbus does have a history of a “love it then leave it” mentality when it comes to new development.

    But considering the arena development and the success it’s had in triggering vitalization in it’s immediate (and not so immediate) surroundings, I’d be hard pressed to come up with anything that would have had a more positive overall, and long lasting, impact.

    #340366

    cheap
    Member

    DTown said:

    But considering the arena development and the success it’s had in triggering vitalization in it’s immediate (and not so immediate) surroundings, I’d be hard pressed to come up with anything that would have had a more positive overall, and long lasting, impact.

    there was a 200 year old prison there.

    you could have put a chuck e cheese where the arena is ,and the area would be revitalized.

Viewing 15 posts - 556 through 570 (of 589 total)

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