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Grandview Yard Giant Eagle

Home Forums General Columbus Discussion Development Grandview Yard Giant Eagle

Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 778 total)
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  • #496084

    catnfiddle
    Participant

    Will there be bike racks? I tend to ride to get groceries, not walk.

    #496085

    JeepGirl
    Participant

    anillo said:
    Walking over a giant parking lot during the summer sucks too.

    Why wouldn’t a pedestrian just follow the street sidewalks to the side with the store entrance?

    Based on the picture, this layout seems to be pretty accessible for local pedestrians as well as drivers.

    #496086

    Cole
    Participant

    derm said:
    I understand what you all are saying about incorporating a building or business within a city, but that is not really the case here. This is being incorporated into the side of a neighborhood, with the other side being a big road and a river. And the nieghborhood it is closest to is easily walkable to.

    Grocery stores also dont lend well to the majority of people walking to them or biking to them in most cases. Sort of like a lumber yard or a cinder block store. Most carry bags of things with some weight out of them. Or frozen things, or multiple bags. Very different then going to a restaurant or coffee shop or a music store or a park. Most people drive to be able to get stuff home. I went to Kroger for two things today and I drove. They were 30# of cat litter and a sixteen pound bag of cat food. Not doable on a bike and not fun walking.

    We’ll have to disagree about the utility of bicycles. Biking errands are easy and I have hulled 28 lbs of kitty litter in a pannier. Depending on the layout of the cat food, I could have hulled it as well.

    To:

    Obviously, a car will always have more hulling capacity than a bike but it is incorrect to assume that bikes have no utility in cargo hulling.

    #496087
    derm
    derm
    Participant

    Cole said:
    We’ll have to disagree about the utility of bicycles. Biking errands are easy and I have hulled 28 lbs of kitty litter in a pannier. Depending on the layout of the cat food, I could have hulled it as well.

    To:

    Obviously, a car will always have more hulling capacity than a bike but it is incorrect to assume that bikes have no utility in cargo hulling.

    I think you are misunderstanding me. At no point in any posts did I state that bikes had no utility in cargo hauling. Your umbrage is misplaced.

    I will say that I will not be hauling my feline sundries on a bike for all the tea in China however. Kudos to you though.

    I am pro bike and pro walking, that is why I live in Grandview. It was not an accident I have a house here, I chose it deliberately. My walk score is 94. My wife and I passed over many places to live in our tiny little overpriced house in order to be able to walk and bike to all the things we like. We voted with our pocketbook, and made sacrifices to do so.

    As I stated in my first post. I think this Giant Eagle is completely walkable, bike friendly and pedestrian friendly. Others may think differently. I cant wait to ride my bike over to it. If the pavement is too hot, I plan to persevere. If I have to push that extra hundred yards to the entrance I will do so. Should cars be using the parking lot, I will be watchful of them. I am glad that Third Ave will be upgraded in the end as it sucks to get to the Olentangy bike path currently. I am just saying I dont see the major downside others are seeing, and this is my neighborhood being impacted.

    #496088

    mrpoppinzs
    Member

    I think they are saying that it could be designed better to incorporate pedestrians. Grandview is very walkable and the Bank Block (Stauf’s Building) is a nice example of an urban strip plaza that works well with parking in the back and built to the sidewalk of Grandview Ave. Compare that to Walgreen’s on 5th – you can’t enter from the corner (where the crosswalks are). You have to walk past the entrance to get around the wall and then back track through a parking lot. You can get to both on foot, but the Bank Block seems so much better.

    #496089

    Cole
    Participant

    derm said:
    I think you are misunderstanding me. At no point in any posts did I state that bikes had no utility in cargo hauling. Your umbrage is misplaced.

    I had intended to imply more sarcasm/snark in my post and less umbrage. However, this is what got my attention:

    derm said:
    I went to Kroger for two things today and I drove. They were 30# of cat litter and a sixteen pound bag of cat food. Not doable on a bike and not fun walking.

    My point is that, yes, it is doable on a bike and it isn’t overly burdensome.

    As for the development, I generally prefer no setback. I feel uneasy walking in parking lots because any car could be trying to back out at any second. I rarely hear about pedestrians being run over in parking lots but it’s still something I think about. I prefer accessing a store directly from the road on which I am walking.

    #496090
    derm
    derm
    Participant

    Cole said:
    I had intended to imply more sarcasm/snark in my post and less umbrage. However, this is what got my attention:

    My point is that, yes, it is doable on a bike and it isn’t overly burdensome.

    As for the development, I generally prefer no setback. I feel uneasy walking in parking lots because any car could be trying to back out at any second. I rarely hear about pedestrians being run over in parking lots but it’s still something I think about. I prefer accessing a store directly from the road on which I am walking.

    I appreciate your candor. This line made me laugh.

    I will say however you are overestimating my biking ability. The litter was actually the 40# box of Pet Pride multicat scoopable litter. Plus sixteen pounds of Purina Indoor formula cat food. What percentage Columbus bikers do you think can or should attempt to bike that home over two miles? And you are worried about being in a parking lot? I will take the dangers of the Giant Eagle parking lot over trying to bike that load home. Everyone has their worries. I will not speak for the rest of the CU community, but I did not bring home something I want to bike with. I think an informal poll of users would say that they might drive on this one.

    #496091

    cheap
    Member

    anillo said:
    Walking over a giant parking lot during the summer sucks too.

    wtf,are you serious?

    #496092
    rus
    rus
    Participant

    derm said:
    I think an informal poll of users would say that they might drive on this one.

    No kidding.

    #496093

    Cole
    Participant

    derm said:
    I appreciate your candor. This line made me laugh.

    I will say however you are overestimating my biking ability. The litter was actually the 40# box of Pet Pride multicat scoopable litter. Plus sixteen pounds of Purina Indoor formula cat food. What percentage Columbus bikers do you think can or should attempt to bike that home over two miles? And you are worried about being in a parking lot? I will take the dangers of the Giant Eagle parking lot over trying to bike that load home. Everyone has their worries. I will not speak for the rest of the CU community, but I did not bring home something I want to bike with. I think an informal poll of users would say that they might drive on this one.

    I was only addressing what could or couldn’t be done. If you’re uncomfortable with biking with that amount of extra cargo, that’s cool with me. If I’m uncomfortable in parking lots, that’s (obviously) cool with me as well. And if you and the CU community is uncomfortable with biking home kitty litter, that’s also cool with me. I only did it once because honestly, who the hell is going to get kitty litter while biking on a regular basis?

    Speaking more about being worried, I’m not sweating bullets in parking lots. It’s just an additional concern that I would prefer to avoid if all developers suddenly listened to me. I used to live on Dennison Avenue right next to Goodale Park and the VV Giant Eagle. The VV Giant Eagle was nice even with its setback. However, the renderings of the Grandview Yard project looks like a giant parking lot which would lend itself to higher speeds when compared to VV. Additionally, for transit users it’s easier to get to their destination if the entrance is on the main drag.

    But to your point about who can/should attempt biking with the extra load, I don’t want to put any percentages. However, the miracle that is gears* makes it pretty easy to tote a wide variety of loads home. You’ll obviously go slower with heavier loads but riding slow isn’t the end of the world. If anyone thought as much he/she would probably be driving instead anyway.

    But really, I’m pretty laid back and think that you should do what you are comfortable with. I’ll do the same.

    *I should note that if you already use a low gear ratio and pedaling is already strenuous, then yes, adding additional cargo would likely be a poor idea.

    #496094

    futureman
    Participant

    rus said:
    No kidding.

    For me it doesn’t matter how people are getting to this store and more about the design and layout of the northern section of the Grandview yard. I could care less about how people getting there, and I agree with posters that yes I’d drive to get groceries but that shouldn’t determine the style of the store. Large box store with a huge setback combined with out-lots with drive thru’s is the bigger issue. Why can’t it be a shared use single story garage, with the Giant Eagle with 1 or 2 stories of office or apartments above? Cost aside, this kind of development is inline with what the freaking$!! grandview yard web site states this is the goal – an urban neighborhood.

    Lennox Town Center – Phase 2 … for better or worse.

    #496095

    heresthecasey
    Participant

    It’s not about “is it possible to walk to (blank).” It’s *possible* to walk to lots of places.

    It’s possible to walk along Sawmill Rd, say to Kohl’s, or then across the street to Target, and then on over to Whole Foods. It’s possible to walk along 161, or Morse, or even at Polaris.

    It’s possible to do lots of things. But is anybody actually going to do them, or want or have any desire to do them? This is the fundamental difference between good design and bad design.

    It’s about making a place somewhere you would want to walk, somewhere you want to be. Is the space set up to create a pleasant experience for a pedestrian? Is it appealing, is it safe, is it lively, interesting, scaled correctly to its environment, &tc?

    Is it a space that I actually want to occupy, versus some hell I just drive through at 40 mph while moving from box to box?

    Cities, and vibrant urban spaces are all about creating the former, and should as much as they can avoid the latter. I don’t understand why this is so hard a concept to grasp. Do we want to create places worth being in? Or do we just want to throw up crap?

    Believe me that there is plenty of that already. I think it’s about time we start to demand some real value from new developments. It really shouldn’t be too much to ask for.

    #496096
    Jason Powell
    Jason Powell
    Participant

    Not to be an ass, but it’s obvious from these three pages of comments that there are many who do not understand the true concept and meaning of “pedestrian friendly”. The last two posts sum it up pretty well.

    #496097
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    derm said:
    …seems very pedestrian friendly to me.

    It sounds like what you’ve been describing is “pedestrian functional” and not “pedestrian friendly”.

    If a development is designed for cars first and people second, it’s more likely functional rather than friendly.

    As a related example of the difference… when I walk between home and work, I can take Long Street or Gay Street. They both have sidewalks, and therefore are both pedestrian functional.

    Gay Street is traffic calmed, cleared sidewalks, trees for shading through a lot of it, separation of sidewalks from lanes of travel with used parking meters, greenery and other dividers, and other thoughtfully implemented features. Auto traffic rarely goes above 20 mph, making it easy to cross and relatively quiet and safe.

    Long Street on the other hand has narrow sidewalks obstructed with parking meters (some in the middle of the sidewalk) and utility poles. Some areas have metered parking, but its rarely used and more often an extra travel lane right up against the curb. There’s no separation of sidewalk from cars. Traffic whizzes by at 35-40 mph. It’s noisy, and can be a challenge to cross with four or five lanes of speedy single-direction traffic. There are several crosswalks at non-stoplight intersections that are flat out dangerous to try to cross at despite the law stating that cars need to stop for pedestrians to cross. They simply don’t do it.

    Gay Street is pedestrian friendly. Long Street is not.

    So yeah… round about way of saying it… but a sidewalk is often not the answer on its own. If you want to see a walkable community, you’ve got to design a space above the bare minimum requirements. Sawmill Road has sidewalks but that doesn’t make it pedestrian friendly either.

    #496098
    derm
    derm
    Participant

    Walker said:
    It sounds like what you’ve been describing is “pedestrian functional” and not “pedestrian friendly”.

    If a development is designed for cars first and people second, it’s more likely functional rather than friendly.

    As a related example of the difference… when I walk between home and work, I can take Long Street or Gay Street. They both have sidewalks, and therefore are both pedestrian functional.

    Gay Street is traffic calmed, cleared sidewalks, trees for shading through a lot of it, separation of sidewalks from lanes of travel with used parking meters, greenery and other dividers, and other thoughtfully implemented features. Auto traffic rarely goes above 20 mph, making it easy to cross and relatively quiet and safe.

    Long Street on the other hand has narrow sidewalks obstructed with parking meters (some in the middle of the sidewalk) and utility poles. Some areas have metered parking, but its rarely used and more often an extra travel lane right up against the curb. There’s no separation of sidewalk from cars. Traffic whizzes by at 35-40 mph. It’s noisy, and can be a challenge to cross with four or five lanes of speedy single-direction traffic. There are several crosswalks at non-stoplight intersections that are flat out dangerous to try to cross at despite the law stating that cars need to stop for pedestrians to cross. They simply don’t do it.

    Gay Street is pedestrian friendly. Long Street is not.

    So yeah… round about way of saying it… but a sidewalk is often not the answer on its own. If you want to see a walkable community, you’ve got to design a space above the bare minimum requirements. Sawmill Road has sidewalks but that doesn’t make it pedestrian friendly either.

    Keep in mind that I live in Grandview. I see a walkable community everyday. Take another look at the picture . I will be entering the picture from the right. The vast majority of of my ride is on 25 mph shaded roads, easy to cross, safe and quiet. I completely understand what you and others are saying on this. Only the last little bit is parking lot, and crossing 3rd avenue. I dont think that moving the store to the street or making it two stories with apartments on it will adjust the majority of my walk or ride or modify the traffic patterns on third. Not for me or anyone else in Grandview. This store replaces the crummy on 5th. They are not making the mistakes that store is burdened with. It is a matter of aesthetics now. If I was coming from OSU or Harrison West it would be different. I bike and walk already to the Grandview Yard as a fun exercise. Try the apps at the Buckeye Grill. I dont have a Sawmill Rd experience, I dont have loud fast traffic, there are not any five lane highways. I already enjoy biking to this place, I will enjoy it more with more stuff to do. Do I wish it designed better? Probably. It is not my money however and the current design is easily modified. Betcha they put a Get Go in on some of it. Shade trees take time to grow, plans evolve over time. My pedestrian experience to this place is different than others will be, thus my view of the viability of this place is different.

Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 778 total)

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