Concealed Carry in Ohio

[News]

Concealed carry rules loosen; permits on rise

By Lynn Hulsey and Laura A. Bischoff

Sunday, April 22, 2012

COLUMBUS — In the eight years since Ohio passed a concealed weapons law, county sheriffs have issued 296,588 permits to carry firearms in purses, holsters and vehicles, with more than half of those coming since President Barack Obama was elected. Gun laws are in a spotlight throughout the country as Florida’s Trayvon Martin case and the presidential election heighten debate over who can carry concealed weapons, where they can carry them, and when they can use them for deadly force.

READ MORE: http://www.daytondailynews.com/news/dayton-news/concealed-carry-rules-loosen-permits-on-rise-1363791.html

[cheap]

HB 256 would eliminate background checks and gun safety classes required for concealed carry permits, while HB 422 would repeal the requirement that a permit holder who is pulled over in a traffic stop alert law enforcement that he or she has a loaded weapon.

“Those two are bad law in a significant way,” Biehl said.

The sponsors of the bills could not be reached.

why not report who the whackjobs are that sponsorred these 2 crazyass bills?

lazy journalism at it’s finest

[derm]

Republican House Majority Whip John Adams sponsored 256 and co-sponsored(with 13 other Republicans) 422. He is a former Navy Seal, and thus would seemingly think firearms training a good thing.

[joev]

How is a background check a bad idea in any world? Crazy gun nuts are crazy.

[rus]

derm said:
Republican House Majority Whip John Adams sponsored 256 and co-sponsored(with 13 other Republicans) 422. He is a former Navy Seal, and thus would seemingly think firearms training a good thing.

On one hand I tend to agree; training is a useful thing. On the other, I don’t want to see costs for formal training stop people from obtaining CCW permits.

South Africa, for instance, has a $500 per firearm permit tax which effectively keeps tools of legal self defense out of reach of many poor people. Of course such high fees do nothing to reduce crime ( quite the opposite it seems ).

I’m all in favor of poor people and unpopular people, along with everyone else, being armed to the teeth and licensed to carry weapons and kill their attackers. Dead rapists don’t rape.

Still, four states have no restrictions on carrying a concealed weapon. It’s not like the idea hasn’t been in practice there for a while.

[cheap]

before my girlfriend took her class to got her CCW permit,she’d blow $20 worth of shells before she’d hit even close to the bullseye.
after her CCW class,she still shoots way low.
i thought she was blind,until she finally told me all those genital shots on the target were her bullseye.
damn.

[derm]

rus said:
On one hand I tend to agree; training is a useful thing. On the other, I don’t want to see costs for formal training stop people from obtaining CCW permits.

South Africa, for instance, has a $500 per firearm permit tax which effectively keeps tools of legal self defense out of reach of many poor people. Of course such high fees do nothing to reduce crime ( quite the opposite it seems ).

I’m all in favor of poor people and unpopular people, along with everyone else, being armed to the teeth and licensed to carry weapons and kill their attackers. Dead rapists don’t rape.

Still, four states have no restrictions on carrying a concealed weapon. It’s not like the idea hasn’t been in practice there for a while.

You still can be. Ohio has open carry. No one needs to spend a penny on a permit, they can just get a 3.99 holster from Vance’s and head outside. So money should not come into play in terms of self defense/CCW. You can legally carry an AR-15 down High Street if you wish. I dont have a problem with waving the instruction for CCW for that very reason. Why spend a whole weekend and 150 bucks to conceal what you are legally able to open carry? I am not sure I like the firearm policy in terms of hiding from the cops, as I am pro-Police. Their job is tough enough I also think we should do more background checking of gun owners personally. It is silly easy to get a gun in Ohio around any rules. Ohio is the Wild West however and with our 90% Conservative Legislature I think we will see less restriction, not more.

On a related note, if this passes, I will apply for my CCW immediately as I dont hav e free weekends to go to Blackwing for the testing.

Edited to add, I do think the training should be mandatory for firearms, but the NRA would have a conniption fit at the thought of it. When I first got a pistol, I signed up right away for a Certified Firearms instruction class. I cannot imagine why that is not mandatory, just like a driving instruction class.

[rus]

@Derm: I’m more in favor of CCW than I am open carry. If a potential attacker can’t determine if their target is armed that increases the risk of carrying out such an attack for them. Thus even those who choose to not CCW can benefit from such a regulatory scheme.

[Tom Over]

rus said:
@Derm: I’m more in favor of CCW than I am open carry. If a potential attacker can’t determine if their target is armed that increases the risk of carrying out such an attack for them. Thus even those who choose to not CCW can benefit from such a regulatory scheme.

Good point

[Oak]

I’m pro-police, a CCW license holder and gun enthusiast and I’m split on these two. 256 repealing training is crazy. I sat through the 12 hour class at Blackwing (they made it a great class btw). I didn’t really learn anything; I was just putting my time in, but someone who was new to shooting would have learned a lot. The class at Blackwing isn’t a firearms class (teaching you how to shoot) but a legal and ethics class on when to/not to shoot. I think that keeping the training is good.
What is problematic, there is no checks/balances on the trainers. The law says you have to have 12 hours of training by a NRA certified trainer. But there is no one who actually checks to make sure that people are in the seats. It’s entirely possible (and I hear is happening out towards Zanesville after talking to the guys at Hocking Valley guns in Nelsonville) that someone out there is taking your $150 then giving you a certificate which you can then use to get your CCW permit.
HB 422 is redundant for something that already happens. When you get your CCW permit, your record in LEADS (Law Enforcement Automated Data System) is updated to show that you’re a CCW permit holder and likely armed. If an officer runs your plates (and they’re registered to you) or does a database check of your other information, they will be made aware of your CCW status. So the requirement that you inform the officer that you are a CCW permit holder and armed is really redundant.

[myliftkk]

rus said:
@Derm: I’m more in favor of CCW than I am open carry. If a potential attacker can’t determine if their target is armed that increases the risk of carrying out such an attack for them. Thus even those who choose to not CCW can benefit from such a regulatory scheme.

The proof of this is what exactly?

Where’s the evidence that potential attackers rundown a mental checklist on which CCW is even a concern (as if most criminals are going to make the seemingly wise decision of evaluating for CCW while making a veritable laundry list of poor ones)?

If any of these things were true in a correlative sense that mattered, Maine wouldn’t be the most peaceful state in the country (I mean, you can’t carry in bars there still, also known as victim holding pens).

[Oak]

myliftkk: Actually criminals do run down a subconscious mental checklist before committing a crime. For a crime to be committed, they have to have the means, motivation and opportunity. When a criminal picks a victim, there is a “victim selection” process that happens. Do I as the criminal have the means (weapon or physical strength), motivation and opportunity (no cops around, dark, victim is distracted, victim has no means to fight back) to commit this crime? If all the indicators are “yes” then a crime might be able to be successfully committed. If there is an element of potential failure (victim might be armed)then the risk might be worth more than the rewards. At times, a criminals motivation might override good risk/benefit analysis and they attempt a crime which a reasonable person might believe would result in failure (and then they fail).
But there is a victim selection process that criminals do go through and wondering if the person is armed does factor into that process. The unknown variable of CCW does present a problem in the selection process.

[misskitty]

You still can be. Ohio has open carry. No one needs to spend a penny on a permit, they can just get a 3.99 holster from Vance’s and head outside. So money should not come into play in terms of self defense/CCW. You can legally carry an AR-15 down High Street if you wish.

I prefer the CCW way as well. I know we have always had open carry but it seems risky as hell. I can imagine that if you are walking along with a AR-15 in tow even if it’s not loaded you run the chance of being shot by a officer who thinks it’s something else all together. If is not a quick shooter that sees you then chances are you will spend the next few hours being interrogated or detained until they work everything out.

[derm]

misskitty said:

You still can be. Ohio has open carry. No one needs to spend a penny on a permit, they can just get a 3.99 holster from Vance’s and head outside. So money should not come into play in terms of self defense/CCW. You can legally carry an AR-15 down High Street if you wish.

I prefer the CCW way as well. I know we have always had open carry but it seems risky as hell. I can imagine that if you are walking along with a AR-15 in tow even if it’s not loaded you run the chance of being shot by a officer who thinks it’s something else all together. If is not a quick shooter that sees you then chances are you will spend the next few hours being interrogated or detained until they work everything out.

I agree, I am not heading downtown with a rifle any time soon. Just being illustrative. I do however see open carry on occasion, especially at festivals downtown, pistols in belt holsters. So anyone who wished to carry a firearm for self defense does not need to spend extra to get a CCW license. They can open carry if they need to feel safer. Does it signal a crook, yep it does, but better than nothing if that is what they wish. I think open carry would be effective. Go into any pawnshop in a rough part of town, they usually carry open and right at their fingertips. At Vance’s they carry concealed, but at the Powder room they open carry.

[jackoh]

The question that I have is: if you want to eliminate the restrictions on obtaining a CC permit, why have a permit or the requirement for one in the first place?

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