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City of Columbus May Shrink Pearl Market - RESOLVED

Home Forums General Columbus Discussion City of Columbus May Shrink Pearl Market – RESOLVED

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  • #452254
    rus
    rus
    Participant

    clumsybell said:
    If you don’t like paying for parking, then don’t drive.

    Close… should read “don’t drive downtown“.

    If you make it a hassle for people to go downtown, fewer will.

    The bus isn’t an option for some people; I can think of one person I know who rides COTA and that’s because he’s too crippled to drive. Figure a number of people wouldn’t even know how ( although google transit helps a lot with that, it’s no hopstop ).

    #452255

    StowCbusCleveland
    Participant

    berdawn said:
    Can one not assume from that statement he does not support this action? It seems rather straightforward.

    I was hoping for more than the non-quote attribution that was given. I was curious to see if he thought any particular solution was best.

    #452256

    econJoe
    Participant

    Part of the problem with parking is that there are market distortions. We subsidize sprawling development in this country at the expense of dense sprawl, maintaining artificially low prices for drivers. If people paid what it really costs to maintain the suburban lifestyle, dense mixed-use neighborhoods would most certainly be cheaper.

    #452257

    wynnie
    Member

    The Pearl Alley Market is a great idea, but some aspects have been horrid (in the past 2-3 years). I love walking to the market from my office to pick up produce on my lunch break. However, I have not been going as often as I would like because there are a lot of vendors that sell a considerable amount of JUNK. This should be a farmers’ market, not a venue to sell cell phones, enter a drawing to win a car, or sign up for supermarket advantage card. Such corporate intrusion is antithetical to the slow food / locavore movement…and it’s a huge turn-off.

    It will be interesting to see which vendors stay.

    #452258

    wynnie
    Member

    gramarye said:
    manticore is correct. The bus system in Columbus is not adequate to bring enough shoppers to downtown on a consistent basis to support the kind of retail development downtown that will make it a vibrant place that people will want to live and invest in. Nor would upgrading the public transportation system to create such a network be quick, easy, or cheap, particularly when one contemplates extending such a network all the way out into the suburbs from which downtown hopes to attract visitors. Even a good public transportation system will be only a complement to auto infrastructure.

    Parking may be cheap in Columbus compared with New York or Boston or San Francisco, but Columbus is not New York or Boston or San Francisco. The very legitimate concern of lizless and other business owners opposing the parking rate hike was that it made Columbus (particularly the downtown neighborhoods where there are a lot of metered parking spaces) less competitive against Columbus’ suburbs. That was the same concern, manifesting differently, that lizless mentioned earlier in this thread with respect to sidewalk-use policies.

    I AGREE with you that COTA is not going to be all things to all people, nor was it created (or will it ever have the support) to be a “big-city” transit system. Attitudes vary widely here and Columbus is very spread out, so it’s currently impossible to serve everyone. But, COTA does do a good job moving people downtown. The number 21 night owl and the number 2 High Street buses are great. I use the bus all the time… both to get to work downtown and to take it home when I have been out and about.

    I AGREE with you that Columbus is not NY, Boston, SF, etc. People should stop comparing Columbus with mega-cities. If I hear Columbus compared to Portland one more time…

    But, here is where I disagree with one small point: anything south of Nationwide Blvd. does not generally appeal to the suburban crowd…save MAYBE Thurman’s and Lindey’s. The suburbanites want to show off and be seen at Hyde Park and Rossi. So do suburbanites really care about paying an extra $1 per hour when they are drinking a $10 martini? How cheap does a person have to be to use that excuse?

    If drivers don’t want to keep feeding a meter, there are plenty of surface lots and garages downtown.

    #452259

    PZH1355
    Member

    I felt like I needed to comment since I began participating in the Pearl Alley Market last year and feel it has been a wonderful platform to have for my small locally owned business. I have dealt with the same city departments that are trying to minimize the market and can say that they are difficult to deal with and clearly have a problem with the market. But that really is just me giving some background information on why I feel the way I do(obviously biased).
    The market provides local small biz owners and farmers a consistent place to conduct business in our city. The key words being “local’, “Farmers” and “our city”– I can respect all opinions, but why should we limit these things in our city? Why should we inhibit or restrict? We are a capital city with a downtown that is not the downtown of a Capital city. I firmly believe Mayor Coleman has moved in the right direction to help spur growth in our downtown and revitalize it. You may live here and not visit, like, or care for the Market and that is fine; but this helps strengthen our local economy and promote growth. Two things, which I feel are very important.
    Ultimately, this decision which has caused some vendors to be removed from the market is negatively affecting the citizens, families,small businesses,our City, and our city’s economy. Farmers and Small businesses need a place to start and that is what Pearl Alley Market has provided for me and I am thankful for Walker bringing this discussion to Columbus Underground and causing a discussion.

    #452260

    misskitty
    Participant

    wynnie said:
    The Pearl Alley Market is a great idea, but some aspects have been horrid (in the past 2-3 years). I love walking to the market from my office to pick up produce on my lunch break. However, I have not been going as often as I would like because there are a lot of vendors that sell a considerable amount of JUNK. This should be a farmers’ market, not a venue to sell cell phones, enter a drawing to win a car, or sign up for supermarket advantage card. Such corporate intrusion is antithetical to the slow food / locavore movement…and it’s a huge turn-off.

    It will be interesting to see which vendors stay.

    I agree lol
    I was rather put off to see the stand selling energy shot and crap the other day.
    They could fit in more valuable offerings if they could cut the crap loose. You know The Dispatch stand, Caffeine guy, etc.
    Also if food carts have a special permit allowing them to be on the side walk why not move them to the side walk and free up more space within the ally. Then they could cut their information tent down in size and fit one or two more small vendors in that area.Can they not extent East and West in the ally? It seems like the managing is a little crazy at the moment. Over all this year it has seem less farmers market and more randomness.

    #452261

    manticore33
    Participant

    clumsybell: I think you missed my point entirely, and I was giving some of my viewpoints as an outsider who loves the Short North and loves to see Columbus succeed! Furthermore, I advocate and recommend many local Columbus businesses to my friends, peers, and whoever else will listen.

    The downtown community is not in just competition with itself in terms of customers; it is in competition with the entire region. It is in competition with Cleveland and Cincinnati for that matter! Majority of Columbus’ population lives outside of downtown proper. Any policies or regulations that make downtown more hostile can and will cause competitive advantages for its neighboring communities.

    Central Ohio lacks adequate public transit. While I support green initiatives (I car pool and drive only ever 3rd week to work; round trip is 22 miles), I realize most people have cars and travel by cars. You will have to “deal with cars” until the city reaches the density or critical mass to really push for better public transit and/or light rail (which I use when on my business trips to Atlanta). To take public transit to go from Delaware to Columbus takes over 1.5 hours one way. Furthermore, that connecting route from Delaware to Crosswoods is only available Monday – Friday during business hours.

    And, yes, I am extremely thankful for my “cheap” community and will advocate it too when I can. Maybe take a look at my town sometime and maybe visit unique places like Stratford Ecological Center (http://www.stratfordecologicalcenter.org/) which is about a half mile from my home. Ohio is blessed with dynamic, unique, and interesting communities beyond its major cities.

    #452262

    PZH1355
    Member

    misskitty -I can understand some of the points you bring up with some of the vendors there. The main reason there are not as many farmers is not because they wouldn’t have them, but because of our weather patterns the yield of the crops have not been as good or have been wiped out completely. It is also necessary to have the farmers on Broad street because they can then park their trucks behind them which hold majority of there product. As I mentioned, I do agree with some of your thoughts but to say anything about the management is completely out of line if you are not involved directly and know all of the facts.

    #452263

    cc
    Member

    misskitty said:
    I agree lol
    I was rather put off to see the stand selling energy shot and crap the other day.
    They could fit in more valuable offerings if they could cut the crap loose. You know The Dispatch stand, Caffeine guy, etc.
    Also if food carts have a special permit allowing them to be on the side walk why not move them to the side walk and free up more space within the ally. Then they could cut their information tent down in size and fit one or two more small vendors in that area.Can they not extent East and West in the ally? It seems like the managing is a little crazy at the moment. Over all this year it has seem less farmers market and more randomness.

    I think these are really constructive points. The food carts can be shifted to the sidewalks and some of the knickknacks seem better sold at CVS.

    I just had a thought though:

    It is possible that the food carts may question paying extra vendors fees to Pearl Alley when they can freely vend on the those city sidewalks (Broad St. etc) as part of their food cart license.

    #452264

    ZHC
    Member

    clumsybell said:
    What this person said is spot on and it’s why I have a problem with Liz Lessner associating this issue with parking meter increases….

    Well it seems like others have covered much what I was going to say in response to this. In particular Walker’s comments

    but let me add this

    Clumsybell I was one of the business owners you probably were referring to. I did speak out at council against the meter raise and was somewhat involved with the effort to block it. Believe me it was not something I enjoyed doing at all (in part because I know I have customers who feel the way you seem to that by doing so we are whining etc), but after ~100 complaints from many longtime customers I felt I had no choice.

    In any event It was a lot more complicated than it appeared in the media and I’m glad the city changed their plan for the meters, as their previous plan would not only have been disastrous for us personally but also for the city as well as their original plan had a pretty major key false assumption on future capacity usage baked into it.

    some but not all of the issues we faced can be found in this very long thread

    http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/columbus-parking-meter-rates-now-higher-than-nyc-and-boston

    I don’t want to derail this off pearl market any further, but feel free to PM me if you want. I’d be happy to discuss why we did what we did with you.

    In any event I think if you talk to most of us you’ll find most of want a lot of the same things you do. I would like to see a better financially supported and more freqent mass transit system and would really love to see density return to our core. I don’t view having appropriately priced meters as conflicting with that goal at all.

    FWIW I do agree with you that pearl market’s particular issue here is of a different nature than the meter increase, but I do think Liz is absolutely right in that there are some major problems on the city’s side with how they handle urban issues and that pearl market is just the latest in what is unfortuantely a long line of needless red tape and PR calamities for downtown.

    #452265

    misskitty
    Participant

    PZH1355 said:
    misskitty -I can understand some of the points you bring up with some of the vendors there. The main reason there are not as many farmers is not because they wouldn’t have them, but because of our weather patterns the yield of the crops have not been as good or have been wiped out completely. It is also necessary to have the farmers on Broad street because they can then park their trucks behind them which hold majority of there product. As I mentioned, I do agree with some of your thoughts but to say anything about the management is completely out of line if you are not involved directly and know all of the facts.

    I only said at the moment I did not want to imply that they are always out of order. Also I see your point about the truck needing a place for their veggies.I am sure as they get things situated with the new rules it will smooth out again. I think with a little cramming and reorganization they can make it work. I have faith

    I wonder is there any chance they can get a permit to close the ally a crossed the street and use that space as well? I know that may seem like a stretch but you never know. I think a concern though would be with those unused buildings a crossed the ally they tend to drop glass and rock at random times so that may not be a good idea. Nevermind.

    #452266
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    wynnie said:
    anything south of Nationwide Blvd. does not generally appeal to the suburban crowd…save MAYBE Thurman’s and Lindey’s.

    I believe you’re trying to make the point that the Short North is a popular destination, which I’d agree with… but I highly disagree that there’s no general regional “suburban interest” in anything else going on at our Downtown Theatres, festivals, park spaces, event spaces, restaurants, COSI, etc.

    #452267
    Walker Evans
    Walker Evans
    Keymaster

    misskitty said:
    I was rather put off to see the stand selling energy shot and crap the other day.
    They could fit in more valuable offerings if they could cut the crap loose. You know The Dispatch stand, Caffeine guy, etc.

    Over all this year it has seem less farmers market and more randomness.

    I kind of like that it’s more than just a farmers market. Makes it unique. There’s over 30 farmers markets in the region, and if the Pearl Market were restricted to growers only, then I think it would suffer.

    #452268

    News
    Participant

    Sidewalk ban might pinch other vendors
    Wednesday, July 20, 2011
    BY LAUREN HEPLER
    THE COLUMBUS DISPATCH

    Should farmers market vendors be able to set up on sidewalks?
    Neighborhoods beyond Downtown could feel the effects if the city continues a crackdown on vendors operating on Columbus sidewalks.

    Pearl Market had to scale back this week because Columbus is enforcing a city code that allows only pushcarts with city permits to set up shop on sidewalks.

    READ MORE: http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/local_news/stories/2011/07/20/sidewalk-ban-might-pinch-other-vendors.html?sid=101

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