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The Columbus Dispatch wrote
Struggle for development in Franklinton
Homes not right fit for neighborhood, leaders say
Sunday, October 28, 2007
By Mark Ferenchik
Vince Gazzara wants to build four houses in Franklinton, the poor Columbus neighborhood of century-old houses just west of Downtown that is struggling to reverse its fortunes. But he doesn’t want to build basements, garages or porches. So neighborhood leaders — as much as they want new construction — don’t want his houses.
The houses Gazzara wants to build aren’t fancy. They’re two-story, vinyl-sided homes on slabs that would sell for $75,000. Carol Stewart, who leads the Franklinton Area Commission, said she wants better.
If nothing else, this episode is another example of the difficulties of building in the city’s core, especially Franklinton, where builders couldn’t go until the massive floodwall around it was finished in 2004.
Related Stories:
- Franklinton: The new Short North?
- City hopes to make Franklinton streets safer
- City demos two more blighted homes in Franklinton
- Franklinton rehabs bring in some new life
people have always been investing in Franklinton and buying low…those people aren’t on this thread or in Mayor Coleman’s office and they’re not the ones trying to sell me on the hype.
My point, again, is that I’ve seen for going on a year now this talk of Franklinton being the next this and the next that…and don’t know a single person who’s put their money where their mouth is…but they just keep putting their mouth there for more lip service.
Again, it strikes me that the plan for rehabbing Franklinton is to tell enough people that it’s going to be great that eventually someone will believe it enough to buy in. If the tellers were doing the buying we could skip right to Franklinton being great, but that’s not happening.
Again, it strikes me that the plan for rehabbing Franklinton is to tell enough people that it’s going to be great that eventually someone will believe it enough to buy in. If the tellers were doing the buying we could skip right to Franklinton being great, but that’s not happening.
So by the same token are people not allowed to get excited about development in downtown proper? Because I love keeping on top of all the talk of every new condo developing coming downtown, and I tend to spread the news here every chance I get… but my current number of downtown condos owned is still zero.
If only the people who’ve moved into downtown were allowed to talk it up then we’d have an awful lot less to talk about around here. :?
LOL…come on now Walk, as effective as this website is, surely we’re not now claiming that it was a driving force behind the revitalization of downtown living.
When you’re talking downtown condos and vitality…it’s a real thing that’s happening. You’re talking about current events, not trying to spark something that you don’t believe in yourself enough to spend a dime on.
When you’re talking about The Franklinton Arts District or all the great happenings and bright future in Franklinton, you’re talking about wishes that apparently no one is all that committed to.
BTW, you know why downtown living is happening? Not because developers needed to be told for a couple years what a great idea it was, but because they just decided it and built it.
You know why downtown residents moved there? Not because they had to be convinced of it, but because after they were built by those developers they bought them.
I don’t see those developers buying up areas of Franklinton for redevelopment on any scale, regardless of the city begging them to and paying them to. I see a guy who wants to dump 4 double wides on slabs for 75k each.
I don’t see the hip or artistic crowd snuggling into the affordability and future of Franklinton, turning it into the next big thing…I just see the hip and artistic crowd telling me I should.
well, it’s actually happening downtown though. there are tangible things like buildings going up and signs showing the new buildings and banners advertising for the new places. is there anything actually happening in franklinton? i never go through the area, so i don’t know, but i haven’t heard of anything real going on.
if i had money to invest in property to sit on, i’d be looking at areas like urbancrest rather than franklinton.
There were also people who didn’t buy into the hype of the Short North back in the 80′s. Those people are buying high over there now considering it was just named one of the best places to retire. The Short North didn’t take one year to become what it is today so who is saying that it’ll take just a year for Franklinton to turn around?
I’ve been in Columbus since 1994 and in just 13 years I’ve seen the Short North do a complete 360, or at least a 180. That said, I’m anxious to find out what the next 13 years will bring to Franklinton. Sure, it won’t be as “great” as the Short North, but it’ll be alot better than it is now. But even one year, two years, three years, is not enough for Franklinton to skip to being great. But at least people ARE doing things.
In just the last year, The Franklinton Arts District has done plenty of things including investing their time and energy to bring the arts to Franklinton. I’ve only been a member since last spring and I’m amazed at everything that has been accomplished inside and outside the group. I am someone who has put my money where my mouth is and there are other members who’ve done a helluva lot more than me. And then obviously through the group I’ve met residents of the community who grew up there, who’s families survived the floods and actually stayed or have come back because they want to see the area survive.
The floodwall was just completed in what…2004? Until then, nobody could even actually BUILD in Franklinton. Student nurses live in the brand spanking new building that Mt. Carmel West built on Town Street. Houses are popping up and being renovated and in my opinion, things are going at a fairly good pace.
Nope. No one was claiming that.
I’ve posted plenty of stories about speculation, announcements, and awareness that has come before projects are ever off the ground. The only time this ever seems to be a problem for you is when the location is in Franklinton.
Personally, I’d recommend anyone to live in just about any downtown neighborhood that fit what they’re looking for. But I can’t live in every downtown neighborhood at once, and what I’m personally looking for might not have anything to do with what someone else is looking for.
The fact of the matter is… some people are interested in Franklinton. Maybe not you. Maybe not me. But why should that halt anyone from talking about it or promoting the area as a part of the greater whole of revitilizing all of the neighborhood in and around downtown?
No one? Or “no one you know”? I’ve heard you mention it time and time again that you don’t personally know anyone involved in/with Franklinton and so therefore nothing exisits over there. It’s a very strange thing to constantly hear.
Yep. The city/mayors office had nothing to do with it at all.
Now that you mention it, I’ve never seen anything promoting downtown living or trying to convince anyone to live there. Thanks for shedding some light on this.
All I’ve ever tried to say about the neighborhood is that is has potential. Same goes for a lot of Olde Town East, the Far South Side, Weinland Park, The Hilltop, etc. And I’m going to keep saying it whether I live there or not.
Personally, I only know two artists who live in Franklinton. Theres only a few others I know of, but not personally. I’m sorry that they’re not on this website to give you their two cents.
Yes. If you look at the first post in this thread there are Related Stories linked that will take you to some of the past articles regarding Franklinton development. Everyone should feel free to overlook these as they see fit. ;)
I guess I got lost on what started this whole thread. I don’t agree with that specific dude who wants to build shit on top of shit. My point was that he’s not the only guy trying to build homes in Franklinton. The other homes look better than what that guy had in mind. Will a condo eventually go up in Franklinton? I don’t know, I haven’t heard much lately about the old B&T Metals site or any other condo developer. But what does it take to bring a developer to an area? I don’t have a clue? But I can only do what I know how to do, so thats why I joined the Franklinton Arts District.
Now while most people don’t know anyone that lives in Franklinton, I’ve only met one owner of a downtown condo. Maybe I need to get out more. But, haven’t sales in downtown condos dropped because people aren’t grabbing them up? Didn’t I see somewhere (maybe this site) that they’re actually auctioning some off this month?
And, why weren’t these condos built when City Center was in it’s heyday? Other than maybe the Arena District, I wouldn’t want to live in a downtown condo unless I got it for what I got my house for….and that sure as hell ain’t gonna happen. Maybe if all the condos sell like hotcakes, they’ll need more room and FINALLY give in and build in Franklinton.
I love Franklinton. I live in the Arena District and from time to time drive this area and think about a rehab or new construction. It will be a great area some day, the economic markets are simply a bit slow right now. We should all be thankful for how strong this city is and is becoming. This site is just the forum for this city pride, so keep it coming! I believe that many cu users do help to promote this city. I just met the first one just the other day. We all seem to light up talking about knowing what is going on in our areas.
Some day I may put my money where my mouth is and leave the more developed urban hype for a slower to develop area. It is only a matter of time. It is a cycle. It sounds something like Loft. Cottage. Yard. Dog.
Well, with the Home Again program, if developers thought there was any real potential here, nothing else would be required.
Just to break it down, buy 4 lots…build 4 homes…sell them at cost and you make 100 grand because the city pays you 25 grand each for each house just to do it.
If that isn’t getting developers sprinting out there, nothing will.
Which has been my whole point all along.
p.s. As far as the comparison to downtown housing development to this, my memory of the beginnings of this, from Miranova on, was a helluva lot more “If I Build It, They Will Come”…and not “please build it, we want them to come” from other sources. Sure, once the floodgates opened there were some tax incentives and some hype, but I don’t think for a minute it would have mattered if a couple of those projects didn’t have the numbers behind them already (like Miranova) to make believers out of the rest.
Now, if Ruscilli or Pizzuti or whoever ran into Franklinton, bought up a dozen lots, built…say…100k homes on them and they sold like hotcakes…and then collected their 300k subsidies on them…then you’d have some steam behind this.
And my point all along is that it’s not going to happen over night.
I’m just someone who won’t be surprised if the Franklinton of 2020 is something worth talking about considering its location and it’s history (the first settlement in central Ohio). The only reason there is anything even going on in Franklinton right now is because the floodwall was completed.
“It’s completion in 2004, which began in 1993, brought relief to business owners and residents of the flood-prone area who have endured property damage and high insurance costs due to persistent flooding.
The 7.5-mile, $129 million floodwall will protect 2800 acres and its completion is expected to spur revitalization efforts.”
I’m glad you don’t believe the hype Coremodels, if everyone bought it, there wouldn’t be much to fight for.
I don’t think anyone has to explain to me why Franklinton IS desirable.
Maybe I’m just drinkin’ the Kool-Aid that a few people are serving.
I think I had some of that same kool-aid.
My friend and his wife just moved onto Dakota. He purchased one of the Home Again rehabbed houses. I had a chance to look around inside.
I’m now planning on moving into one this spring. Here’s why:
1. They are beautifully rehabbed. I was REALLY SURPRISED at how nice they are inside. My friend is also my foreman at a small home remodeller here in town. I didn’t believe that the work had been done to a decent degree of competence, but he had no qualms with how it was done.
2. I would argue that the crime in the area (West Franklinton, anyway) is overrated. My buddy spoke to his CPD buddy, who said that we civilians go largely unhurt by what goes down over there. Don’t worry, my thirdhand info is also supported by anecdotal evidence! His wife feels comfortable walking their dog alone at night (but he is a pretty big dog). I took another friend out there last night to check it out. Minor goonery: kids toking on church stairs, crazy guy gaping from porch. We felt perfectly safe, and his Urban Terror VU Meter is way more sensitive than mine.
3. The city’s plans do not include messing with the (aesthetically questionable, but I like it) historical character of Franklinton’s housing, and it does not do so.
4. I think West Franklinton especially poses an alternative path to development in Columbus. We’ve already got the Short North and German Village, but where can regular folks buy/let their kids ride bikes around? We can create a livable, REALLY middle-class neighborhood for families and dogs in good old Columbus. It can compete against the lower-tier suburbs with the advantage of…
5…. I think the vibe there is really cool. Granted, I’m a native Zanesvillian who still listens to Slayer a lot, but i think it’s cute and folksy.
Anyway, that’s my shattering riposte. Cool website, by the way!
Awesome. Thanks for taking the time to share your story. I’ve been hoping we’ll get an insiders perspective on this conversation. :D
Welcome to the site!
I listen to Slayer a lot too. You should checkout LoPan, local band I bet you would like based on your profile interest in stoner metal.
[url]http://myspace.com/lopandemic[/url]
Heck yeah, man. I’ve seen Lo-Pan at least 6 times. They’re some really nice guys, too.
Posted with permission:
I just happened to find your Columbus Underground when I did a Google search for my name. Quite a surprise to see that much chatter about the Franklinton story.
The Dispatch story was really lame and I expect that it was also intended to be factually incorrect. I am only pointing this out to you in case you might want to get together and have a serious conversation about the problems and solutions for that area. So the first problem with the story itself is the porches. The reporter was told by Carol Stewart that I would not build a porch. The original plan submitted to her and the FAC had the same 8 ft x 4 ft porch that I built with my own house in Worthington. When Stewart complained about the size, I expanded it to 12 feet and resubmitted it. It is here on the main page of our website http://www.GazzaraBuilders.com It also has a picture of me that I like better than the one the reporter took that looks like it was taken through a peephole. It is surprising that the reporter made it through the whole piece about the features of my plan without including the link so that readers could actually see it.
There are practical limits and parameters for the Franklinton area that cannot be ignored by anyone investing their own money there, even if the city kicks in their $25,000 at the end of the project. First, assuming that the new house might actually attract anyone who does not have to live there, the amount of the mortgage is limited by area comps. This is a hard limit and if you are buying a house on Yale or Stewart, the banks are not swayed by a few non-profit rehabs next to Mt Carmel on Martin. If you build a house with the features that boost the selling price to $110,000, then the buyer would likely have to bring at least $30,000 for a downpayment.
The “$90,000 houses” on Martin were rehabbed by the non-profit City County Holding Company which spent $120,000 on the houses that they sold for $90,000. Also, Martin has some of the very few large and decent homes on the area and it directly borders Mt Carmel.
There is no “green space” in Franklinton. Most of the vacant lots are simply bare ground between boarded up abandoned houses.
The 35 new houses that the CHP is building are all rent-to-own houses that cannot be purchased for 15 years. They likely will end up as HUD section 8 rentals with the same tenant problems as all of the other rental houses in the area. My understanding is that the rents will be about $750 – coincidentally about the same amount HUD will finance. For $750 you can rent a nice 2 bedroom apartment on Bethel Rd.
Many of the non-profit rehabs, like the one that the Franklinton Development Assoc did on Belows, are financial losers. They spent $100,000 of public money to produce a rehabbed house that they cannot sell for $65,000. Yes, it is rehabbed, but this is like offering someone a completely restored mint-condition 1982 Plymouth for $20,000 or a brand new KIA for $20,000. Nobody expects the KIA to be a future classic, but most people would prefer a new car to an old restored car. These are not Corvettes here in F-town, they are more like old Ford Pintos and Chevy Vegas.
Home Again, the same city non-profit group with a few sales on Martin, has had a rehabbed home for sale on S. Yale for about a year with no takers. The house next to it as abandoned and condemned, and a family is living in the garage. Across the street is another boarded up house. Next to that is one of the lots that I applied for. This was considered one of the better lots.
Non-profits are in the worst position to be developers. They really have no concept of costs and cannot set any real objectives. Their main objective is to spend the money and generate good will so they can get more money. That’s how you end up with the 35 new rental houses which the FAC claims are for sale – yeah, after 15 years of being run down by renters.
So there is a lot involved in actually starting construction in Franklinton. If there was any potential for a real market, builders and contractors would be there. You have to first make a realistic assessment of the immediate market potential, then design directly to that assessment before investing $75,000 of you own money. You also have the current situation of about 15,000 relatively poor and mostly white residents who have to live somewhere cheap. I expect that many of them used to live in Victorian village, Marion village, Italian village, etc before those areas became yuppyized and too expensive. Not likely that they will leave Franklinton because there is no place else to go. Even less likely that yuppies with good incomes, new cars and nice stuff will move into the center of an area where many people spend their summers sitting in couches on their front porches, drinking beer and without shirts. You don’t want to be the only residents in a desparate neighborhood with something worth stealing.
So there you go Walker, something to think about. I do not think there will be any private building in Franklinton for at least 10 years. In the mean time Habitat, the FDA and the CHP will continue to build rental houses and rehabs that even the Franklinton resident do not want or cannot afford. For my part, I was trying to offer as much as possible at the market limit of $75,000 without losing my ass in the process.
If you ever get together with other people like yourself to discuss urban houses, etc – I would take some time to tell you the practical experience I have had with the Franklinton fiasco. I have given up on the deal, but I still find it interesting to talk about.
Vince Gazzara
Good response.
Don’t think I see things the same way, but there are a lot of factors that don’t fit into a black-and-white picture of who’s doing what’s best for the neighborhood.
Dang, that takes some of the wind from my sails. I figured the rehabs were losers, but the bleak picture of the future there is kinda sad.
I’ll still win out, based on the “can live pretty cheaply til I die” basis. Maybe my friends and I will be struck by evil redevelopment genius after we go there.