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COLUMBUS City Council meeting – Streetcars to get public hearing next week
Tuesday, April 22, 2008 3:06 AM
By Robert Vitale
Columbus City Council members complained last week that they’ve been left out of the loop on Mayor Michael B. Coleman’s streetcar plan.
Last night, they made the loop bigger.
The council will host its first public hearing next week on the $103 million proposal to build a 2.8-mile rail line between Downtown and Ohio State University. The council’s decision came in an impromptu debate at the end of the weekly meeting.
The day and time haven’t been firmed up, but Councilwoman Maryellen O’Shaughnessy said she wants the session to take place before the council votes on Coleman’s proposed 2008 capital budget.
That budget, which includes a $2 million request to begin design and engineering work for the streetcar line, is scheduled for council action on May 5.
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Streetcars to get public hearing next week
By: lazyfish
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I would disagree with this 100%, and in fact other cities have tied their streetcar stations to entire pedestrian mallways.
http://www.portlandmall.org/about/index.htm
or
or
And the game show goes, DING DING DING, we have a winner.
Brewmaster…you continue to say Broad St Streetcar will fail.
Haven’t you seen the 22 reports that show it will be a success?? It’s 22-0!! The streetcar WILL bring economic development. It WILL bring jobs. IT IS GUARANTEED…and at no point have these arguments had a specific location requirement.
Haven’t you been reading your comrades points??
Now if the Streetcar ONLY works on High street….then all your arguments fall apart and our concern that this is just a toy is probably justified.
I never said any of this.
I feel like CU isn’t useful for this debate. The conversation moves too quickly and my words are either completely ignored or taken out of context.
If greenhouse, Columbuzz, BCOZ, Tigertree, or whomever would like to meet me for a cup of coffee, I’d be happy to talk about it. I don’t think I come across as the nutcase you guys have tried to portray streetcar supporters to be. It’s a fun game to call me names and cause a stir, but I’m tired of it. It’s frustrating for me. I should have followed Walker out of these threads a few weeks ago, but my own personal interest keeps sucking me back in.
Questions are healthy. Rampant pessimism is caustic…and this rampant pessimism is about to drive me, and a whole slew of other optimistic young people right out of this town. We want to make this town better while we’re here, but the pervasive self-loathing, “we suck” attitude, is terrible. I’ve never lived, or even visited a place that has so much going for it, but hates itself so much.
Yeah it’s funny, by and large (park and ride excluded) I am not driving to a bus or rail stop and parking to get on. And when I get off at my stop, I don’t have a car there waiting. That is a broad generalization, but I would say the majority of the urban transit riders are walking from place to place along their stops. Thus it is pedestrian development, in relation to the transportation development.
Brewmaster…you continue to say Broad St Streetcar will fail.
Haven’t you seen the 22 reports that show it will be a success?? It’s 22-0!! The streetcar WILL bring economic development. It WILL bring jobs. IT IS GUARANTEED…and at no point have these arguments had a specific location requirement.
Haven’t you been reading your comrades points??
Now if the Streetcar ONLY works on High street….then all your arguments fall apart and our concern that this is just a toy is probably justified.
I never said any of this.
I feel like CU isn’t useful for this debate. The conversation moves too quickly and my words are either completely ignored or taken out of context.
If greenhouse, Columbuzz, BCOZ, Tigertree, or whomever would like to meet me for a cup of coffee, I’d be happy to talk about it. I don’t think I come across as the nutcase you guys have tried to portray streetcar supporters to be. It’s a fun game to call me names and cause a stir, but I’m tired of it. It’s frustrating for me. I should have followed Walker out of these threads a few weeks ago, but my own personal interest keeps sucking me back in.
Questions are healthy. Rampant pessimism is caustic…and this rampant pessimism is about to drive me, and a whole slew of other optimistic young people right out of this town. We want to make this town better while we’re here, but the pervasive self-loathing, “we suck” attitude, is terrible. I’ve never lived, or even visited a place that has so much going for it, but hates itself so much.
+1.
I would disagree with this 100%, and in fact other cities have tied their streetcar stations to entire pedestrian mallways.
http://www.portlandmall.org/about/index.htm
or
or
but thats not what we’re doing.
Regardless, the reason streetcars were chosen to serve the pedestrian malls is that they are pedestrian friendly, and pedestrian oriented transit.
Which was what you claimed it wasn’t.
Again though, I firmly believe if the streetcar ran from campus or the Short North to say…Third Ave. in Grandview, you’d be on the other side of this argument all together.
Really, Core, will you please take a pill? In the same way you’ve chastised me for the tone I take in my replies and the way it makes you ignore what I’m saying, you are becoming personally insulting in these discussions. And, really, stop calling people liars. Both (who was it? Columbus, BCOZ?) and I have made a statement as to our true wishes (mine that I was wrong and the streetcar was rampantly successful), you’ve all but actually used the word liar. I know you’re better than this from the past discussions we’ve both been a part of. Use your words, Core, to carry your passion, not beat people over the head. Maybe your honest-to-God faith in the streetcar is making you get like this, but it’s just ending up a lot of dickery.
Regardless, the reason streetcars were chosen to serve the pedestrian malls is that they are pedestrian friendly, and pedestrian oriented transit.
Which was what you claimed it wasn’t.
But he was talking about what we were doing here. in Columbus. Stop splitting hairs.
Again though, I firmly believe if the streetcar ran from campus or the Short North to say…Third Ave. in Grandview, you’d be on the other side of this argument all together.
Really, Core, will you please take a pill? In the same way you’ve chastised me for the tone I take in my replies and the way it makes you ignore what I’m saying, you are becoming personally insulting in these discussions. And, really, stop calling people liars. Both (who was it? Columbus, BCOZ?) and I have made a statement as to our true wishes (mine that I was wrong and the streetcar was rampantly successful), you’ve all but actually used the word liar. I know you’re better than this from the past discussions we’ve both been a part of. Use your words, Core, to carry your passion, not beat people over the head. Maybe your honest-to-God faith in the streetcar is making you get like this, but it’s just ending up a lot of dickery.
How BCOZ entered the thread:
Flame on…though I wish that some of you would be more honest in your desire for a streetcar. If you think it’d be neat to barhop on a streetcar, just say that…because IMO that’s a hell of a better (and more effective) argument in favor of the streetcar that the variety of predicted panacea out there.
Again though, I firmly believe if the streetcar ran from campus or the Short North to say…Third Ave. in Grandview, you’d be on the other side of this argument all together.
Really, Core, will you please take a pill? In the same way you’ve chastised me for the tone I take in my replies and the way it makes you ignore what I’m saying, you are becoming personally insulting in these discussions. And, really, stop calling people liars. Both (who was it? Columbus, BCOZ?) and I have made a statement as to our true wishes (mine that I was wrong and the streetcar was rampantly successful), you’ve all but actually used the word liar. I know you’re better than this from the past discussions we’ve both been a part of. Use your words, Core, to carry your passion, not beat people over the head. Maybe your honest-to-God faith in the streetcar is making you get like this, but it’s just ending up a lot of dickery.
How BCOZ entered the thread:
Flame on…though I wish that some of you would be more honest in your desire for a streetcar. If you think it’d be neat to barhop on a streetcar, just say that…because IMO that’s a hell of a better (and more effective) argument in favor of the streetcar that the variety of predicted panacea out there.
Yeah…way to quote out of context (what “this one” was I referring to? It was the “This streetcars will make autos obsolete” post)
So how about it, Core?
Are you behind a Broad st. streetcar and not a high street one?
Tell us why…since you are an educated streetcar expert and I am just a “moron”? Oh…please quote the studies you claim to be expert on too.
Hey Walker…I guesss you don’t board police pro-streetcar folk who cry “moron”?
I don’t police the board while I’m eating dinner.
Core, the insults are unnecessary. Please keep it civil. I’m tired of having to play hall monitor here. Everyone needs to step back, take a deep breath, and state their opinions on the TOPIC without interjecting insults of any kind directed at each other.
PLEASE and THANK YOU.
edited – walker stepped in…
but people can choose who they respond to in any discussion on here. if someone is baiting on either side, just leave their opinion aside and they usually fade out.
Couple quick points:
I personally dont care that Mayor Coleman left, because this was for City Council, but I do see why people are upset. The part that I find funny is that people seem to have ignored the fact that Councilwoman Tyson left at the same time. Wasn’t she one of the people that wanted public input and more information? Nice.
I love the idea of getting a people together to talk about this. I do feel we go in circles on here sometimes, so there needs to be differnt form of discussion.
Also I was kind of wondering what the common ground is for people. Such as:
Do we agree Columbus has a transportaion problem?
Do we agree that downtown Columbus needs something to spark developement?
Do we agree the bus system alone is not the answer?
One final point. It is hard to get everyone who is for the streetcar to speak up because most have already left for greener pastures. I’m not saying I think the streetcar is the cure all answer, but I will say I’m 100% sure we need to do something and we need to do it now. I would really like to hear other opinions on how to jumpstart the city.
Wow! Now there’s some scientific, um, science.
This quote reminds me of what the artists have been saying about the Short North for awhile now. That they have been priced out and are not reaping the benefits from what they created. It would be really cool if Tigertree and other boutique stores were able to find a building along the proposed streetcar line that they could own together, and then they would be the ones that stood to directly gain from the streetcar benefit zone.
Also I was kind of wondering what the common ground is for people. Such as:
Do we agree Columbus has a transportaion problem?
Do we agree that downtown Columbus needs something to spark developement?
Do we agree the bus system alone is not the answer?
Columbus has a transit issue. COTA is at a great point to begin repairing this issue and have begun the steps to do so. But too many stories pop up of missed buses, poor service and other issues. It is not a streamlined system and very inefficient-or so it seems. With 26 buses to choose from at Broad and High, navigating our current system (especially for visitors making a trip within that 4-5 mile radius of downtown) can be intimidating at the least.
It is really chicken and egg, a very twisted circle, when it comes to the redevelopment.
Mayor Coleman is pushing streetcars as a tool to revitalization to bring more downtown.
The public does not see the point, since, in their view, there is nothing downtown.
By and large our business community, so it would seem, has not made any effort to commit to bringing jobs downtown through relocation.
One has to give at some point and be the catalyst. Wouldn’t it be great to see Wexner or another major Columbus community bring its headquarters downtown?
Since Columbus has been shown to be one, if not the only, of the major cities without light rail. Light rail and bus co-exist very well in a multitude of cities (DC, NY and Chicago all come to mind) to provide a multi-modal network of transit.
There is plenty of space in strip malls with plenty of free parking that stores can move to if they think the streetcar is such a terrible idea. I think that new strip mall on Fifth with the Papa Johns is open. Geez.
Tigertree, I love to see that you are calling businesses that have already lived through this. That is being proactive and getting some real answers. Nice work.
I’ll tell you what, if I saw, even two major businesses express interest in moving downtown as part of its development, it will sell me a lot more on this. Has anyone heard anything at all from any kind of major business saying that they’re looking at moving downtown? Does anyone have any thoughts on who might move downtown? Limited is way too big and there’s no way they’re giving up that big beautiful black box. A lot of other major business players have just built buildings on the outskirts. I don’t know, I just can’t think of anyone who might move into one of those office buildings. Or are we thinking retail? you gotta have population to have retail. At least the SN has population that lives close. downtown doesn’t have many residential options within acceptable walking distance to the line where I would think most retail would try to get to. I’m just trying to figure out what the development might look like.
probably plenty of space in those other cities that already have rail, too.
nice attitude.