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Request for streetcar design is shelved
Tuesday, May 6, 2008
BY ROBERT VITALE
Bowing to criticism from council members who’ve complained about being left out of the debate and responding to concerns of residents and businesses, Mayor Michael B. Coleman removed a request to begin design of a High Street route and acknowledged he has more selling to do.
In a memo to Council President Michael C. Mentel pitching his $103 million idea as a catalyst for economic development, Coleman said, “While these issues are clear to me, our public needs more information.”
Council kept $2 million in the 2008 capital-spending plan that Coleman had requested for design and engineering of a 2.8-mile streetcar line from Downtown to Ohio State University. But it took the streetcar label off the money at the mayor’s request.
Councilman Kevin L. Boyce said last night’s decision to remove streetcar references from the $1.1 billion capital budget shouldn’t be interpreted as a rejection of the mayor’s plan. Leaving in $2 million without an earmark shouldn’t be interpreted as an endorsement, either, he said.
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Request for Streetcar design is put on hold
By: Walker
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And where are these council members, not to mention the critics when it comes to dumping millions on a couple of roads? Not a peep, but if you want rail we have to do a gazillion studies before they’ll even consider it and by that time the money will just be spent on road. To paraphrase Kunstler, they must be those people who think the Earth has a creamy nougat center of oil. Think of the rise in price in the next four years accompanied by lower and lower output and only maybe having a 3 mile line.
This delay would make sense regarding the projected 2012 date for the streetcars. Mayor Coleman remembered to consider the bullsh!t factor. We need a “take back the streets” movement for peds and cyclists to take over streets in Downtown and sections of High. Hold special events there and block off the roads as this city gives way too much preference to cars over all else.
I think idealistic bullshit like that, along with celebrating the rise in gas prices doesn’t help your cause.
No one is ever going to be won over on account of their own misfortune.
Idealistic how? And I’m not celebrating the rise in gas prices, just pointing out that the laws of physics are real. Most peoples actions do not reflect an acknowledgment of how reality works and instead are imposing what they want reality to be, but it doesn’t work that way. We can either begin moving people around using less energy or we can keep our current system with all of its negative implications.
There are cars.
Cars need roads.
I realize that we must inform the bikers and tree-huggers of this fact before any more discourse can continue.
Bikers, BTW….you do not have the “right” to the roads…you have the privilege of being allowed on the roads.
If you start to act out against automobiles, you may lose that privilege.
Werd.
Back away from the bong, doood
Living in Europe now for 2 years I have seen many pubilc transportation systems that are just incredible. The best one by far though was Berlins that included Light rail, Underground, buses & yes, Streetcars. They are still useful even with a broader transportation project. As for traffic it should not be an excuse because if we always use it to shoot down mass transit proposals, it will only compound the problem in the end anyway. Even with all that mass transit in Berlin traffic can obvously still be bad… but could you imagine it without it? To me it is inevitable that Columbus will eventually have to adopt a mass transport policy, so it always leaves me shaking my head at all of the people stalling it along the way. All it does is slow the growth of Columbus’s downtown core compared to other major cities and when we’re trying to attract the new generation work force, you definitely need a thriving downtown.
Cars need roads.
I realize that we must inform the bikers and tree-huggers of this fact before any more discourse can continue.
Bikers, BTW….you do not have the “right” to the roads…you have the privilege of being allowed on the roads.
If you start to act out against automobiles, you may lose that privilege.
Werd.
I’m not a biker, but you are way off. The take back the road movement has already started to happen. I’d look into what happens in Chicago.
Thank you, and actually I can picture a city with a mass transit problem. People should look up what is happening in India, in fact I think CNN just did a report on it. But why learn from other peoples mistakes :roll:
Won’t turn this into bike vs. car, but thought a traffic law refresher was in order.
I think Columbusite makes a good point, and the argument for better mass transit is very strong. With gas prices consistently rising, where does it continue to make sense to fund vast roadway projects, when you can begin creating alternatives to actually help the people?
I would love that. I posted a concept like that here.
Cars need roads.
I realize that we must inform the bikers and tree-huggers of this fact before any more discourse can continue.
Bikers, BTW….you do not have the “right” to the roads…you have the privilege of being allowed on the roads.
If you start to act out against automobiles, you may lose that privilege.
Werd.
Those ideas are incorrect and devoid of thought. Sprawl is the exception where cars are king, since one is totally dependent on them in that environment. The city is not and should not go any further down this route. I know I wouldn’t bike down Broad around 270 even though I enjoy the legal right to do so in this state. You can move to a state where bikes don’t have that right. Love it or leave it! And I didn’t know that entropy only works if you’re high, that’s interesting logic. Now go back under your bridge.
Columbus City Council would like to know what you think about the Adminstration’s Streetcar Proposal. E-mail: CallTheRoll@Columbus.gov to voice your opinion (pleae note, all comments will be posted on-line).
Click here to review comments submitted to members of Columbus City Council.
I’m not sure if Walker already mentioned this, he’s always pretty good at finding this stuff, but it is an email address to share your opinions on the plan. I Found this under O’Shaughnessy’s page on cityofcolumbus.org.
It ended up being a good venting outlet for me though :)
Bikers, BTW….you do not have the “right” to the roads…you have the privilege of being allowed on the roads.
If you start to act out against automobiles, you may lose that privilege.
Werd.
What are you referring to? Your own made-up little rules?
Lay off the bong, dood.
Tuesday, May 6, 2008
COLUMBUS, Ohio — Columbus City Council approved a new public-works budget Monday night, but work on a proposed streetcar line has been put on hold.
Mayor Michael Coleman requested $2 million for engineering studies on running a streetcar along High Street from the Ohio State University campus to Downtown.
City council approved the funding request as part of the $1.1 billion budget but removed references to streetcars.
READ MORE
Tuesday, May 6, 2008
by Matt Burns
A $2 million appropriation for design and engineering work on the proposed downtown streetcar line is still on the table, but it might be harder to find in the $1.1 billion capital improvement budget approved by Columbus City Council Monday night.
Responding to criticism of the $103 million streetcar plan, Mayor Michael Coleman asked that the $2 million earmark be delayed.
“Frankly, we are not ready to spend these resources,” Coleman wrote in a memo to Council President Michael Mentel. “We have an obligation to further educate the public on this proposal’s connection to a more comprehensive rail and transit plan citywide.”
READ MORE
I think it’s just the fact that we tried passing a levy for light rail almost a decade ago and it failed; there’s no indication that enough has changed that it would succeed on a second attempt now. The streetcar line is not meant to be the final link in the chain, only the next one. The point is that the dive-in-headfirst approach (going straight to a comprehensive light rail system) failed, so a gradualist approach is called for: not committing too much capital to any one project at once and letting development start small and get bigger.
Trying to start big ended up with no start at all.
That was ten years ago when gas was $1.00 a gallon….Its almost $4.00…I know that all you prostreetcar people think I am slow on the uptake, however, I think people in general are gaining more perspective due to the increased cost of living. If it was presented and marketed it the correct way instead of being bulldozed through we may see a big difference in the reaction.
I think the education component will be very helpful in changing opinions. I overheard a couple of co-workers talking about this today. Both were against the streetcar. One didn’t like it because she wanted it to go to New Albany, where she lives. I’ve breached the subject with her before, saying that the 2.9 miles is a STARTER system, and that the ultimate goal WOULD be to link in New Albany and all the other high-population ‘burbs. The other didn’t like it because she thought the City was trying to make more money off parking garages. I couldn’t follow her logic, but she had obviously mis-heard someone say something inaccurate.
I don’t think this means that they are AGAINST those things. Maybe they just don’t feel like this is the way to go. Maybe they see other alternatives. This is important to remember, just because someone is against the streetcar, doesn’t mean that they are against development.
I am a transplanted Brooklynite now living here in Columbus for the past 5 years and in order for us to shake the “Whats in Columbus? Cows and Corn?” stereotype that people have of us, we need improvements like a mass transportation system that will revitalize our soured excuse of a downtown metropolis. (and not to mention a shot in the arm for the area between the Courthouse and City Center)
Coleman is a fine mayor and I hope he has enough push to get this through the planning stages. (This could be his Robert Moses-esque mark on Columbus) for future generations. Sometimes people need more of a PUNCH IN THE FACE approach rather than a breath on the neck tactic.
In short, is there no guerrilla style/street team movement to educate the public on the benefits of a street car system for Columbus? Planning, Funding, Infrastructure, Environmental, Tax breaks, etc? If not, it seems the CU community should spearhead such a project. If we are the generation to take over this city in a few years, it should be our voices that jumpstarts the transformation and revitalization of our town as we forge ahead.
I’d bet you $10 that you wouldn’t be able to build a broad and big enough coalition of people to be a strong enough voting bloc to make elected officials care about what is being seen as a vanity project, right or wrong.
Plus as a visitor, I was able to get EVERYWHERE without a car. How nice would it be for visitors to Columbus be able to get on the metrorail at the airport and ride it to downtown in less than 15 minutes for under $2.00? The streetcar will probably take 2-3X that due to being street level and still having to deal with traffic. If this is about development and bringing in visitors, I think we are right on the money for not pushing this forward so quickly.
…so, you went to a city with a rail system you loved…and are now opposed to our starter line because it’s not the same comprehensive system they had there?
not to speak for someone else, but what I took from this is that it’s a great idea, but the way it’s being planned right now will totally mess with traffic, which is a point I raised a long time ago. I think traffic flow is not something that anyone talked about.
This delay would make sense regarding the projected 2012 date for the streetcars. Mayor Coleman remembered to consider the bullsh!t factor. We need a “take back the streets” movement for peds and cyclists to take over streets in Downtown and sections of High. Hold special events there and block off the roads as this city gives way too much preference to cars over all else.
1) I don’t think its fair to compare spends on roads, which a WHOLE LOT of people use that live and pay taxes here, as well as aid the movement of goods and services, thereby helping the economy, to costs for a streetcar. Roads are infrastructure, The streetcar was possible development.
2) Aren’t streets built for cars? How can you take back teh street from something it was built for. If we wanted to take preference away from cars, we would just connect everywhere to everywhere else with little paths and sidewalks.