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Why a Streetcar?

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Started 2 years ago by lisathewaitress
Latest reply from Walker

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Antonio

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That's the devil in the details, at what cost and is it worth it ?

Obviouisly many on CU say Yes, others are skeptical like me and others say this is crazy.

johnwirtz wrote >>
^I understand. I agree that Columbus is definitely more economically healthy than the other cities in Ohio. I think it's kind of a toss-up with Cleveland in terms of urban vibrancy though. They both have their downtown districts and a couple of interesting neighborhoods. I don't know Cincinnati well enough to compare.
Regardless, I was just trying to point out that I don't think the ultimate goal should be, "We have one cool downtown district. We're better than nearby economically depressed cities. Hooray, we're finished!" I think Columbus could do better

Posted 1 year ago #
Pickerington_Kyle

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I really think if Columbus built a streetcar it can do more than just add population to downtown. I think that it could also create more urban habitats and home connecting Deleware/Lancaster/Newark that could end up in resulting in Columbus growing even more? I've been to both Cleveland and Cincinnati in the past 6 months and each city has something that Columbus wished it had. Cleveland of course, has 3 major league sports teams, as columbus has 2 (Blue Jackets and Crew) and the clippers. Cleveland also has the rock n' roll hall of fame. They also have the great lakes science center that i think is very similar to COSI. If anything, I think Columbus Northside beats out Cleveland, even though cleveland has the lake, rock n' roll hall of fame and Cedar point near by. Cincinnati has 2 major sports teams, and relies heavily on nearby mason county, and river for tourism. They're also economically strong with their vast retail business.

IMO: Street car = stronger downtown core = more jobs = more money = greater form of living.

Posted 1 year ago #
Walker
The KLD / Downtown
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Antonio wrote >>
If you have something to refute, then you prove it.

So... you're claiming that you can make up whatever you want and it's everyone else's responsibility to provide proof that what your saying is false?

No.

How about you just quit making stuff up and save us the hassle.

Thanks.

Posted 1 year ago #
johnwirtz
Evanston, IL
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Antonio wrote >>
That's the devil in the details, at what cost and is it worth it ?
Obviouisly many on CU say Yes, others are skeptical like me and others say this is crazy.

I think that's fair enough. Personally, I don't see a ton of transportation benefits coming from the streetcar. It's more just a way to influence development location decisions. So my support would be contingent on the funding mechanisms and their proportions. I was okay with the previous plan.

Posted 1 year ago #
News
Columbus Underground
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The Streetcar As a City's Moving Symbol

MARK BYRNESMAR 16, 2012

With shrinking government budgets and transit usage on the rise, the above-ground streetcar (or tram) is making a comeback. Beyond their efficiency (not to mention their affordability compared to subway expansions), streetcars add a visual charm to any city, no matter the make or model or even the location it serves.

Still, in many ways, the type of rail car a city employs can say a lot about the place. Some of the older ones can suggest a city's affinity for it's history (Milan) or perhaps its lower budget (Poznan). New ones can suggest a city's growing density levels (Seattle and San Diego) or just its attempts to modernize (Athens and Lisbon).

READ MORE: http://www.theatlanticcities.com/design/2012/03/streetcar-citys-moving-symbol/

Posted 2 months ago #
bjones7
Worthington Ohio
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I agree, it is a moving symbol. For example take Market Street in San Francisco. Its basically a high street with mass transit under and above the street. The street cars their do not take you anywhere faster then lets say the muni underground LRT(80% above btw),but its a symbol of the rich history of the city. I mean the buses go faster then street cars from point A to B. However, it goes through historic parts including downtown and the warf. It basically takes the tourist where they want to go.

That said, if Columbus had the old fashion street car of the 1920-1940's going from Short North to German village, think of how many tourist this might bring in from conventions or here for vacation. Screw the newer looking street cars, and bring Columbus polished up 1900'ish street cars through the short north into German Village. That way not only would tourist who are staying in the Hilton(example) feel the urge to go to the short north via Street car, but they could visit the state capital/Columbus commons, Elevator bar, etc, on their way to Schmidts in German Village.

All they Mayor needs to do is convenience the public we need a street car for a reason. 5 years ago the City Failed to do this! Seeing that we are in a mist of building up Experience Columbus, why not have a street car that goes from High and 5th, use a old turn around platform to turn around, then head to high and Livingston, then Livingston/3rd street to eventually Schiller Park?

I don't get why the people of Columbus are so, "challenge" when it comes to thinking on a larger scale of bring people to the city for an example. I've notice a lot of people here, and other places, tend to be comfortable on the state that Columbus is in. Even with all the push by the media/the city.

Posted 2 months ago #
columbusmike

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I agree Columbus could use a streetcar. However, I think the mayor/city needs to be very careful in how it is presented to the public the next time around. Columbus needs a comprehensive transit plan...a streetcar can be the start of it, but it has to have a larger goal in mind. I think a well-polished transit plan for Columbus would be well received, especially if the implementation and cost is extended over 5 or 10 years time. The streetcar the mayor promoted for High Street was fine, but I don't think people understood that there was a larger goal -- growing our mobility and taking cars off the road in a city that continues to grow at a decent pace.

Posted 2 months ago #
cheap
Westgate
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bjones7 said:

I don't get why the people of Columbus are so, "challenge" when it comes to thinking on a larger scale of bring people to the city for an example. I've notice a lot of people here, and other places, tend to be comfortable on the state that Columbus is in. Even with all the push by the media/the city.

there is absolutely nothing wrong with those people,either.

they dont need Columbus to be "hip","trendy" or "popular".

i don't want to see this whole city turned into just another marketing gimmick that downtown has become.

Posted 2 months ago #
Walker
The KLD / Downtown
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cheap said:
they dont need Columbus to be "hip","trendy" or "popular".

When people have a different opinion on something, it means they're trying to be cool and you're just keeping it real?

Are you in middle school? Because this type of argument doesn't sound like something a grown up would say.

Posted 2 months ago #
johnwirtz
Evanston, IL
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bjones7 said:
That said, if Columbus had the old fashion street car of the 1920-1940's going from Short North to German village, think of how many tourist this might bring in from conventions or here for vacation.

I'm skeptical that anyone is choosing cities for convention locations or vacation destinations based on the availability of historic streetcars.

It basically takes the tourist where they want to go.

However, this is important. Mass transit should take people (and not just tourists) where they want to go.

Screw the newer looking street cars, and bring Columbus polished up 1900'ish street cars through the short north into German Village.

Personal preference, but I'll take the spacious modern ones over the rehabbed vintage ones. I think they have more comfortable seating, higher passenger capacity, and wide doors and low floors to speed up boarding.

Posted 2 months ago #
cheap
Westgate
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Walker said:
When people have a different opinion on something, it means they're trying to be cool and you're just keeping it real?

Are you in middle school? Because this type of argument doesn't sound like something a grown up would say.

lmao

Posted 2 months ago #
Walker
The KLD / Downtown
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cheap said:
lmao

I agree with you! It's quite laughable that you want to reduce someone else's point of view into an accusation of them trying to make the city frivolously cooler, which you reject. This type of commentary adds nothing to the discussion, and yet you do it regularly, as if you're insecure with change in the environment around you.

Posted 2 months ago #
bman
New Albany
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Walker said:
I agree with you! It's quite laughable that you want to reduce someone else's point of view into an accusation of them trying to make the city frivolously cooler, which you reject. This type of commentary adds nothing to the discussion, and yet you do it regularly, as if you're insecure with change in the environment around you.

Is this an incident of pot and kettle here though? Many, including you Walker, have made me feel that way based upon my transportation views. Maybe you are seeing Cheap's comment thru a HSR Engineer's glasses?

Posted 2 months ago #
cheap
Westgate
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Walker said:
This type of commentary adds nothing to the discussion, and yet you do it regularly, as if you're insecure with change in the environment around you.

if the words i type on a keyboard adds nothing to the discussion,why respond?

when my dog barks,i don't stop what i'm doing to find out why.

Posted 2 months ago #
Walker
The KLD / Downtown
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bman said:
Is this an incident of pot and kettle here though? Many, including you Walker, have made me feel that way based upon my transportation views. Maybe you are seeing Cheap's comment thru a HSR Engineer's glasses?

I've never said that your opinions are invalid. We may disagree on some things, but everyone is entitled to their own opinions.

My issue is not with someone having a difference of opinion. It's with someone who attempts to discredit other people's opinions instead of making a valid argument.

It's silly. That's all.

Posted 2 months ago #
Coremodels
Really close to Explorer's Club.
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cheap said:
there is absolutely nothing wrong with those people,either.

they dont need Columbus to be "hip","trendy" or "popular".

This argument just isn't a real one anyway. While those people may not use those words, they certainly have their own agenda for Columbus (be it pro sports or auto racing or more malls or a casino).

The "people who want a streetcar are trendy and hip" argument is equally as lame as the "people who want a casino are retired or trashy".

I can make an argument for the streetcar as an investment, driving development and dollars for the city like few other tools will...debate that argument, but don't tell me I don't want a streetcar for those reasons.

Posted 2 months ago #
cheap
Westgate
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Coremodels said:

The "people who want a streetcar are trendy and hip" argument is equally as lame as the "people who want a casino are retired or trashy".

what about people that dont want either of those?

Posted 2 months ago #
Coremodels
Really close to Explorer's Club.
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cheap said:
what about people that dont want either of those?

Then they want something too, maybe its an unchanging or stagnant city...who knows.

Posted 2 months ago #
Walker
The KLD / Downtown
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cheap said:
what about people that dont want either of those?

They're called nihilists, Donny. And they're nothing to be afraid of.

Posted 2 months ago #
Timeone

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I was hoping the Mayor's big announcement at the State of the City was going to be a street car. I think it would be a charming and useful addition to the city. It would connect neighborhoods and encourage people to get out an explore without thinking about parking.

Posted 2 months ago #