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This topic contains 1414 replies, has 90 voices, and was last updated by News News 1 month, 1 week ago.

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  • #379602

    TomOver
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    ColumbusTime said:
    The CBO announced today that the cost of ObamaCare over the next decade will be $1.76 trillion, or an 87% increase over what the Democrats said during the debate/when it was signed into law. It hasn’t even really kicked in yet either.

    Some comparisons might be useful. What has been the cost of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, and the cost, in lost revenue, of the Bush tax cuts for the super-rich?

    Using ‘cost’ in a different way, what might be the cost to our long-term national interest incurred from neglecting to invest in education, alternative energy, and wiser usage of natural resources?

    #379603

    myliftkk
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    The argument wrapped around that number was debunked already: http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/18/how-bad-the-debate-is/?_r=1

    #379604

    pedex
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    myliftkk said:
    The argument wrapped around that number was debunked already: http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/03/18/how-bad-the-debate-is/?_r=1

    that the same CBO with an atrocious track record for estimating costs?

    Health care costs have been climbing at about 9% per year, that is a doubling every 8 years roughly…………which means either the health care providers quit raising prices and there is nothing stopping them from doing so OR it gets to a point where the system just breaks completely and it isn’t far away. The govt is currently borrowing about $1.4 trillion per year over its tax revenues. It isn’t a matter of “if” any more but “when”. Same deal with interest rates, our govt and FED have painted themselves into a corner with no way out, if ZIRP is removed its game over.

    #379605

    myliftkk
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    pedex said:
    that the same CBO with an atrocious track record for estimating costs?

    Health care costs have been climbing at about 9% per year, that is a doubling every 8 years roughly…………which means either the health care providers quit raising prices and there is nothing stopping them from doing so OR it gets to a point where the system just breaks completely and it isn’t far away. The govt is currently borrowing about $1.4 trillion per year over its tax revenues. It isn’t a matter of “if” any more but “when”. Same deal with interest rates, our govt and FED have painted themselves into a corner with no way out, if ZIRP is removed its game over.

    You ought to refresh your browser every so often.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2012/04/29/health/policy/in-hopeful-sign-health-spending-is-flattening-out.html?pagewanted=all

    In 2009 and 2010, total nationwide health care spending grew less than 4 percent per year, the slowest annual pace in more than five decades, according to the latest numbers from the Centers for Medicaid and Medicare Services. After years of taking up a growing share of economic activity, health spending held steady in 2010, at 17.9 percent of the gross domestic product.

    The growth rate mostly slowed as millions of Americans lost insurance coverage along with their jobs. Worried about job security, others may have feared taking time off work for doctor’s visits or surgical procedures, or skipped nonurgent care when money was tight.

    Still, the slowdown was sharper than health economists expected, and a broad, bipartisan range of academics, hospital administrators and policy experts has started to wonder if what had seemed impossible might be happening — if doctors and patients have begun to change their behavior in ways that bend the so-called cost curve.

    If so, it was happening just as the new health care law was coming into force, and before the Supreme Court could weigh in on it or the voters could pronounce their own verdict at the polls.

    “The tectonic plates might be beginning to shift,” said Karen Davis, the president of the Commonwealth Fund, a nonprofit research group in New York. “It’s hard to believe everything that’s been tried over the last decade to slow spending wouldn’t be making a difference.”

    Experts were surprised, for instance, at a drop in spending on some hospitalized seniors — people enrolled in Medicare, whose coverage the recession should not affect. They also noted that some of the states where health care spending slowed most rapidly were states that were not hit particularly badly by the recession, suggesting that other factors were at play.

    #379606

    Twixlen
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    Who all is following the decision? I’m following http://www.scotusblog.com – which is a live feed. Looks like 10am is when the decisions will start being read, with healthcare coming last (out of three cases).

    I’m sure Twitter will positively explode. There’s already mania building.

    #379607

    revolutionist
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    Twixlen said:
    Who all is following the decision? I’m following http://www.scotusblog.com – which is a live feed. Looks like 10am is when the decisions will start being read, with healthcare coming last (out of three cases).

    I’m sure Twitter will positively explode. There’s already mania building.

    Here’s to actually reading the decision and not simply parroting talking heads.

    #379608

    Twixlen
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    Whatever you do, don’t tune into CSPAN – they’re taking live phone calls from the public. They really need a better vetter.

    #379609

    lifeontwowheels
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    Twixlen said:
    Whatever you do, don’t tune into CSPAN – they’re taking live phone calls from the public. They really need a better vetter.

    Bet you could make a sweet drinking game off the comments.

    #379610
    ColumbusTime
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    The MSNBC talking heads want everyone to know that if the law is upheld, that is great for Obama, and if the law is overturned, that is great for Obama.

    #379611
    Snarf
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    ColumbusTime said:
    The MSNBC talking heads want everyone to know that if the law is upheld, that is great for Obama, and if the law is overturned, that is great for Obama.

    lol. coming up at 6 o’clock, how cheaper gas prices don’t have anything to do with obama, unless you think they do which is completely fine also!

    #379612

    misskitty
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    lifeontwowheels said:
    Bet you could make a sweet drinking game off the comments.

    You will be hammered in thirty minuets if you took a shot every time someone addressed Obama’s middle name or birth certificate. Add to that a drink for every word like socialist, Nazi, death committee, etc. lol

    #379613

    lifeontwowheels
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    Individual mandate is constitutional.

    #379614

    Mercurius
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    Chief Justice Roberts sided with the left of the court. Really took some courage.

    #379615

    geoyui
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    Mercurius said:
    Chief Justice Roberts sided with the left of the court. Really took some courage.

    That is really surprising. And I agree, it takes some big cajones to do what Roberts did, a Bush appointee.

    #379616
    dru
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    geoyui said:
    That is really surprising. And I agree, it takes some big cajones to do what Roberts did, a Bush appointee.

    it is interesting on Roberts’ part, but many judges have historically gone against the party of the President who appoints them. it drives supporters crazy, but overall gives the SCOTUS its broad legitimacy. however i imagine his security detail is going to be bumped up for a long time.

    the part i do find interesting is that the initial portions of his ruling are that he ruled it constitutional under the second defense, that it is a tax, and taxes are constitutional (though not always wise). It further indicates that it would not have passed under the primary argument of commerce. So it is a current victory for Obama, but has set it up as the classic electoral argument for Republicans: it is a tax that can be repealed. and so it drags on…

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