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Reverend Wright
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ChrisSunami
King-Lincoln District
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Posted 4 years ago # -
Coremodels
Really close to Explorer's Club.
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kitoba wrote I know I'm going to regret this, but... thoughts?
The guy's starting to entertain the hell outta me, I will say that :lol:
Posted 4 years ago # -
gramarye
In Exile
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I spent about 20 minutes watching two of the unedited clips of his remarks at the National Press Club; Part 1 of the Q&A section is where he makes most of his most controversial statements, and I gotta say ... wow.
I can see technical similarities between Wright and Obama in terms of rhetorical style: cadence, accent/emphasis, volume modulation, the occasional use of call-and-response. I seriously pray that the similarities end there when the chips are down, especially if Obama somehow wins the general. I'd take eight more years of Bush rather than four of anyone who actually believes what Wright does. That's not to say Obama does so, but if he does ...
Wow. Just wow. This is one thing that the right-wing attack machine would do better not to editorialize about and just post the raw, unspun clips.
Posted 4 years ago # -
drew
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I think Obama needs to *seriously* reevaluate who he associates himself with. Wright comes off as a gleeful race warrior and a hypocrite and it's absolutely killing Obama. Seems clear to me that Wright's latest public appearances were conducted without any concern for Obama's political well-being at best, and with an eye for his own personal gain on the coattails of Obama at worst.
My guess is that it won't be long before Wright comes out with a book ('The Wright Way To Live'?), DVDs, and a Sunday morning tele-sermon with a 1-800 number prominently shown on the screen. I'll be shocked if, in a year from now, we won't be able to say, "yep, Wright has cashed in."
Posted 4 years ago # -
Brewmaster
Portland, OR
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I think he has an ENORMOUS ego. I think he's said some extremely ignorant things. I think he's killed any chance of my boy Obama being elected.
At this point, I'm hoping Hillary steals the nomination, fights and looting break out at the convention in Denver, McCain gets elected president and proceeds to run the country into the ground for 4 more years. Maybe we'll be ready for a change in 2012.
Posted 4 years ago # -
gramarye
In Exile
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At this point, I'm hoping Obama gets the nomination because I think McCain is the best candidate and he'll have an easier time beating him than her; however, this thread is about Wright. It's still not 100% clear exactly how closely Obama's views map onto those of his pastor's. Obama never fully addressed that issue in his big race speech.
Wright may be forcing Obama's hand, especially if he keeps finding big spotlights like the National Press Club, however. At least some media outlet not completely transfixed with Obamadulation is going to start asking questions beginning with "Do you agree with Rev. Wright's statement that ..."
Posted 4 years ago # -
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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1) He is a nutter.
2) He says some things that are accurate.
3) He says some things that, even if not accurate, are shared by a large number of people who get ignored by the bulk of the media.
In #1 & #3, he is no different than the right-wing evangelicals that the Repubs get all chummy with, but the media doesn't play clips of them over and over and over and over and over.
In #2, he is pretty different than the right-wing evangelicals.
A.
Posted 4 years ago # -
gramarye
In Exile
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The media plays clips of Pat Robertson, Rush Limbaugh, James Dobson, and other social conservative firebrands over and over ... heck they *are* the media in places. The evangelicals saying that 9/11 was God's punishment for our society tolerating homosexuality got airtime enough. The big reason Wright is getting more than most of those others at the moment is because a major presidential candidate was a member of his congregation for 20 years. If McCain had been a congregant of Westboro Baptist, I'm sure we'd be seeing more media attention to that quarter, too.
I think Obama's ostensible secularism also heightens interest in Wright's beliefs because people think they may offer some insight into Obama's inner convictions, about which he's equivocated. Why does no one feel the need to go see what Bush's Methodist minister preaches on Sundays? More than likely it's because there's no need to go looking there; Bush wears his religion on his sleeve, for better, bad, worse, worst, or apocalyptically calamitous. No need to look anywhere else for clues.
I don't even want to know what things he says that people on this board believe are accurate.
Posted 4 years ago # -
Stripe929
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I don' think AIDS was manufactured by the government but we can't act like our governement hasn't done some things in the past that are pretty similar. For forty years between 1932 and 1972 our government is repsonsible for the The Tuskegee Syphilis Experiment which I find appalling.
Posted 4 years ago # -
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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gramarye wrote I don't even want to know what things he says that people on this board believe are accurate.
If you look at the full text of what he has said, you will find plenty. The sermon that springboarded Obama's 'Audacity of Hope' is one example.
Or pointed questions like how we can suddenly appropriate huge sums of money to rebuild NYC when for years government says there is no money for long-term problems like healthcare or education. (Yes, there are answers to that, but those are the kind of legitimate questions large portions of the dis-empowered populace asks.)
The AIDS-created-in-the-lab hooey is believed by a scary amount of people.
Falwell et al got a little blip in the media at the time. There is a vast difference between that and playing these clips over-and-over again under the guise of talking about the Obama campaign. The media loves stories it creates and that is a lazy way of filling time with clips + babbling idiots/reporters.
I don't agree with Wright. I said he was a nutter. But the play this stuff gets is both a fake bunch of crap and totally misses (and enhances) the cultural/racial divide we have. I do find it pretty dubious that we can accept that right-wing Xian-pandering candidates are able to listen to outrageous counterfactuals and be assumed to filter appropriately, but people aren't willing to assume that the racially-tinged stuff can be filtered by Obama to take the empowerment, positive side of things and leave behind the crap.
A.
Posted 4 years ago # -
Coremodels
Really close to Explorer's Club.
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Drew wrote
gramarye wrote It's still not 100% clear exactly how closely Obama's views map onto those of his pastor's. Obama never fully addressed that issue in his big race speech.
At this point, I doubt it matters. It will be assumed that his silence speaks volumes.
what silence?
"When you start focusing so much on the plight of the historically oppressed, that you lose sight of what we have in common, that it overrides everything else, that we lose sight of the struggle of others... It doesn't address what I believe is the power of faith to bring people together."
"When this controversy started, I didn't see this as an attack on the black church, I saw it as a simplification, a caricature of who he was... The only aspect that had to do some people were surprised when he was shouting. That's just a black church tradition."
"Yesterday, I think he caricatured himself. That made me angry, and it also made me sad."
Obama said he had tried to reach him before the Philadelphia speech, and couldn't reach him because he was on a cruise. He says they talked after the speech, but said that he didn't want to discuss their private conversations. He said he told him that he found certain statements unacceptable.
"It may have been unintentional on his part, but I do not see our relationship as the same."
"He was never my quote unquote, spiritual adviser, my quote unquote spiritual mentor, he was my pastor."
More Obama: Wright is "an embarrassment to his campaign" and "not what my campaign is about."
Posted 4 years ago # -
Coremodels
Really close to Explorer's Club.
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Andrew Hall wrote The AIDS-created-in-the-lab hooey is believed by a scary amount of people.
probably a similar number to the number of people that still believe Obama is Muslim and believe Saddam engineered 9/11...
Posted 4 years ago # -
th0m
Beechwold
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I feel bad that some of his (edit: better, not scary) ideas i think Rev. White is trying to get across are very good points that we are NOT discussing in this country, but, he was brought up (or possibly sheltered / entrenched in the role as a pastor) to have language that doesn't do his opinions any good in the current political rhetoric. If you imagine our current situation transposed into the 1950's mindset... a lot of what he says isn't really all that crazy, at least, in my opinion.
Posted 4 years ago # -
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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Coremodels wrote
Andrew Hall wrote The AIDS-created-in-the-lab hooey is believed by a scary amount of people.
probably a similar number to the number of people that still believe Obama is Muslim and believe Saddam engineered 9/11...
But non-overlapping sets which is my point.
The relatively insular chattering classes are pretty up on right-wing conspiracy theories at least to be able to mock them, but underestimate the penetration of leftwing or racially-linked ones.
Though in my elitist, condescending world, N>1 of belief in absurd nonsense is scary.
A.
Posted 4 years ago # -
drew
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Coremodels wrote
Drew wrote
gramarye wrote It's still not 100% clear exactly how closely Obama's views map onto those of his pastor's. Obama never fully addressed that issue in his big race speech.
At this point, I doubt it matters. It will be assumed that his silence speaks volumes.
what silence?
"When you start focusing so much on the plight of the historically oppressed, that you lose sight of what we have in common, that it overrides everything else, that we lose sight of the struggle of others... It doesn't address what I believe is the power of faith to bring people together."
"When this controversy started, I didn't see this as an attack on the black church, I saw it as a simplification, a caricature of who he was... The only aspect that had to do some people were surprised when he was shouting. That's just a black church tradition."
"Yesterday, I think he caricatured himself. That made me angry, and it also made me sad."
Obama said he had tried to reach him before the Philadelphia speech, and couldn't reach him because he was on a cruise. He says they talked after the speech, but said that he didn't want to discuss their private conversations. He said he told him that he found certain statements unacceptable.
"It may have been unintentional on his part, but I do not see our relationship as the same."
"He was never my quote unquote, spiritual adviser, my quote unquote spiritual mentor, he was my pastor."
More Obama: Wright is "an embarrassment to his campaign" and "not what my campaign is about."
I was thinking more about the most recent comments from Wright... though my post pretty obviously suggested otherwise. Obama's in a tough spot, no doubt, and I'm sure he hates to turn his distancing from Wright into a drumbeat but I think that's what needs to happen.
Edit: Well, he came out pretty strongly against Wright here: http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2008/04/29/AR2008042901535.html?hpid=topnews
Posted 4 years ago #
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