Red Sun Rising
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Ever wonder why you crave cheese, burgers, fries, ice-cream, and chocolate etc? They even cover other substance addictions.
To skip cheesy 70's music and introduction, start at about 3:00
"The Pleasure Trap"
http://vsh.voip-info.org/lisle.html
Entertaining video on how to break food addictions without drugs. It could extend the length and improve the quality of your life.
Tenzo
Chicago Lakeshore
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I rather enjoy my 'addictions' ( dependence (also dependance), habit, jones [slang], monkey)
My addictions like; food, Jazz music, working on the house, playing with the dog and <ahem> the wife <wink><wink><nudge><nudge> are what give me the most pleasure in life.
It could extend the length and improve the quality of your life.
Vegans dont live longer, it just seems that way.
[Going to Thermans for a beer and burger at lunch today]
JimL2
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Tenzo wrote >>
I rather enjoy my 'addictions' ( dependence (also dependance), habit, jones [slang], monkey)
My addictions like; food, Jazz music, working on the house, playing with the dog and <ahem> the wife <wink><wink><nudge><nudge> are what give me the most pleasure in life.[Going to Thermans for a beer and burger at lunch today]
Based on the construction of that post, I'd say you left out a few addictions.
Red Sun Rising
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Hey Tenzo,
More power to you :-)
Perhaps you are in perfect health or not struggling with any of the major causes of chronic degenerative disease or popping any prescription drugs. There are many here who are suffering (beyond people with diseases- there are also the non-human animal persons who are suffering)
As to vegan longevity and quality of life, before you poo poo it with the dismissive attitude, perhaps you may want to consider this graph and actually listen to the video. There is a distinct difference between happiness and pleasure.
rus
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Red Sun Rising wrote >>
As to vegan longevity and quality of life, before you poo poo it with the dismissive attitude, perhaps you may want to consider this graph and actually listen to the video. There is a distinct difference between happiness and pleasure.
http://www.diseaseproof.com/Unrefined.JPG
Means absolutely nothing unless you can normalize all other variables ( good luck ) between those disparate populations.
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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That graph is meaningless bullshit. Get some basic reason and skepticism.
A.
Red Sun Rising
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Chill out. Why so threatened guys?
Here's another one:
rus
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Red Sun Rising wrote >>
Chill out. Why so threatened guys?
The "evidence" you're presenting is nothing of the kind. If you want to lie to yourself, feel free. Your life and all.
But don't try to pass off meaningless info as statistical evidence supporting your position. That does a disservice to people looking for honest information and also to your own cause.
After all, if you have to lie to support your cause your cause must be bullshit.
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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Red Sun Rising wrote >>
Chill out. Why so threatened guys?
Here's another one:
I am not threatened. I call out health bullshit when I see it, regardless of source. The latter link is just utterly meaningless without context.
You should learn to apply some common sense and reason to what you encounter, especially when it agrees with your prejudices.
A.
GW_Justice
Grandview Hts.
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If the chart provided by RSR is BS, then the detractors here should have no trouble finding links on the net that show the data is bad.
Until they do that, I will assume they are the ones full of BS.
I'm not saying I believe RSR's data, but at least he provides links.
Red Sun Rising
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Nothing I'm stating here will hurt anyone, in fact just the opposite. Perhaps you should ask yourself why this is so threatening to you? What is with the hostility?
The Five Overloads from Animal Foods that Poison Us
Protein, fat, cholesterol, sulfur-containing amino acids (methionine, for example), and dietary acids poison us when consumed in amounts that exceed the body’s metabolic capabilities to detoxify and eliminate the excesses. Compared to the proper human diet, which is based on starches (see my February 2009 newsletter), animal foods burden us with three times more protein, fifteen times more fat, greater than 100 times more cholesterol, four times more methionine, and at least ten times more dietary acid. Furthermore, the toxic effects of these poisons are interactive. For example, excesses of protein, methionine, and dietary acids work together to destroy the bones. Excesses of dietary fat and cholesterol combine their deleterious effects to damage the arteries (atherosclerosis) and promote cancer. Let me provide some more details on how these five destructive elements from animal foods ruin your health.
rus
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GW_Justice wrote >>
If the chart provided by RSR is BS, then the detractors here should have no trouble finding links on the net that show the data is bad.
Until they do that, I will assume they are the ones full of BS.
I'm not saying I believe RSR's data, but at least he provides links.
Her link implies a single variable is responsible for heart disease.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation
In a widely-studied example, numerous epidemiological studies showed that women who were taking combined hormone replacement therapy (HRT) also had a lower-than-average incidence of coronary heart disease (CHD), leading doctors to propose that HRT was protective against CHD. But randomized controlled trials showed that HRT caused a small but statistically significant increase in risk of CHD. Re-analysis of the data from the epidemiological studies showed that women undertaking HRT were more likely to be from higher socio-economic groups (ABC1), with better than average diet and exercise regimes. The use of HRT and decreased incidence of coronary heart disease were coincident effects of a common cause (i.e., the benefits associated with a higher socioeconomic status), rather than cause and effect as had been supposed.[3]
JimL2
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GW_Justice wrote >>
If the chart provided by RSR is BS, then the detractors here should have no trouble finding links on the net that show the data is bad.
Until they do that, I will assume they are the ones full of BS.
You don't need data to show that the first chart is useless. All you need to know is that claiming "correlation proves causation" is fallacious.
That chart tries to use incredibly broad variables to prove something incredibly specific. Bad bad bad bad bad.
Snarf
Dystopia
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GW_Justice wrote >>
If the chart provided by RSR is BS, then the detractors here should have no trouble finding links on the net that show the data is bad.
Until they do that, I will assume they are the ones full of BS.
I'm not saying I believe RSR's data, but at least he provides links.
Yes, links people...LINKS!
Attention vegans, did you know you swallow about 8 spiders a year accidentally??
^Look a link, OoOoooOooOoo!
Red Sun Rising
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Like I said, watch the video; they put the graph into context.
The American Dietetics Association also states that eating a vegan diet reduces disease rates.
Craig, W. J. & Mangels, A. R. (2009). Position of the American dietetic association: vegetarian
diets. Journal of the American Dietetic Association.109, no. 7, 2. Retrieved
from http://www.eatright.org/About/Content.aspx?id=8357
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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GW_Justice wrote >>
If the chart provided by RSR is BS, then the detractors here should have no trouble finding links on the net that show the data is bad.
Until they do that, I will assume they are the ones full of BS.
I'm not saying I believe RSR's data, but at least he provides links.
People who make claims are responsible for their proof, not the other way around. And some randomass link is not a source.
The first one - the data is just wrong as well as meaningless. eg - The death rate in the US from heart attack + cancer =/ almost 80%. Even it did, it deliberately ignores what that might mean. The death rate in Thailand has something over 1/3 are unregistered as to cause. etc.
Thus the graph is utterly meaningless.
A.
rus
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Twixlen wrote >>
I think any irritation comes from this being about the 75th such thread started in the same overly preachy manner by the same person.
If it were something different, or even moderately interesting, folks wouldn't react thusly.
So long as it stays in the vegan thread, I'm cool. Makes it easy to ignore.
But shit statistics presented as truth are irritating, no matter what the subject is.
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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Red Sun Rising wrote The American Dietetics Association also states that eating a vegan diet reduces disease rates.
No. They don't. It is the damn correlation/causation thing that trips you up every time.
A.
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