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Walker wrote >>
Yeah, I'm not sure why Front isn't two way already. ;)
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Columbus Underground Messageboard » General Columbus Discussion » Development
Downtown 2010 Plan Idea #6 - Bus Transit Station
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joshlapp
SoHud
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COTA recently performed a Downtown Operations Analysis and is having a series of meetings to help plan the future of transit Downtown.
Cbus Transit wants your input so we can communicate to COTA what the public desires for transit Downtown. Please post your thoughts here on CU, Tweet us @Cbus_Transit, vote in our Facebook poll, comment on ourFacebook Page or shoot us an email (cbustransit1@gmail.com)
Posted 7 months ago # -
ehill27
Short North
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Where's the #$@% Statehouse bus shelters!!!
It's the epicenter of downtown, it's on the COTA logo, and it could very well be THE busiest stops in the city. Let's get moving!
Posted 7 months ago # -
Walker
The KLD / Downtown
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Sounds like 2010 Plan Idea #6 might not be happening...
COTA study: Terminal won’t ease congestion at Broad and High
Business First - by Adrian Burns
Date: Friday, July 15, 2011, 2:43pmA downtown transit center for the Central Ohio Transit Authority likely won’t curb bus and rider congestion at Broad and High streets, a study by the transit authority has found, but moving some bus routes off High could help.
While a new bus center a couple blocks away likely wouldn’t diminish bus traffic downtown, moving some routes from High Street to Front, Third and Fourth streets has more potential, COTA spokesman Marty Stutz said. But changes to those routes would mean riders would have to go to other locations to catch a bus, and so it’s important to gather public input on potential new routes, he said.
READ MORE: http://www.bizjournals.com/columbus/news/2011/07/15/cota-study-terminal-wont-ease.html
Posted 7 months ago # -
wynnie
University District
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Walker said:
Let's scrap the transit center idea then, and just implement changes that address the same concerns for retail, parking and adequate bus transfer accommodations:1. Re-route some of the non-High-specific routes to Front, Third and Fourth. According to the Dispatch article, COTA claims that ridership drops if people need to walk a quarter mile from the stop to their destination, which is great because fourth is only .2 miles from High and Third and Front are only .1 miles from High.
Many of the routes that run on High through the middle of the CBD turn off within a few blocks... a mile at the most. Routes 1, 3, 4, 6, 9, 11, 14, 15, 16(north), 18 and 19 could all be shifted to Front, Third or Fourth. Some of the express routes too.
2. Add state of the art covered bus shelters from Mound to Goodale along Front, High, Third and Fourth. Make it so that shifting routes to parallel streets is not a downgrade, and keep all of those waiting environments top quality. Temperature controlled, free WiFi, LED signage with real time bus arrival departure information, etc.
3. Add full time on-street metered parking to High Street between Mound & Goodale. Buses can have dedicated spots to pull in & out like they do in the Short North, or curb bump-outs for bus rides to board.
4. Give buses signal priority through Downtown. There's a lot of stops through this area, so bus rides can be slow Downtown. No reason they shouldn't be given green lights whenever possible.
Done! Problems solved, right? ;) (Easier said than done)
Wow... That's a very tall order. Climate-controlled shelters would be so nice, but I am not going to hold my breath...but, I will sign the petition. In the meantime,it would be great if COTA had more smartphone-friendly "text for next bus" codes on their signs.
I strongly disagree with the transit center AND idea that all non-High Street buses should be taken off of High Street. Many buses like the #5, 7, and 8 also serve the Short North. If you take all other buses off of High Street, the #2 will likely need to run additional buses... and they will go up and down High Street.
Whatever happened to the idea that the city was going to connect all of the downtown communities via public transit/trolley/street car? Has that idea of neighborhood continuation gone out the window?
High Street is where the action is downtown. It's where most employers are based....and I do have to admit that I would stop taking the bus if the decision was made to take my route off High Street. Here's why:
1)I work downtown in an office building on High Street. Often, I work late. When it gets dark outside, I don't want to stray off of High Street because it is generally well lit. Side streets are dark. Additionally, traffic on 3rd and 4th streets move pretty fast and drivers are generally not very aware of pedestrians... especially at night and when the sun sets early in the fall and winter.
2) It's Ohio. It gets cold. I abhor it... and walking on ice. I hate, hate, hate it. That's a long, slow walk in the wind (and in the dark) to go to North 4th Street.
3) Why deal with the elements and safety concerns when I can drive six miles (on my own schedule) and have my parking fee deducted from my paycheck? The convenience factor of taking the bus doesn't exist anymore...which is too bad, because I really want to support transit in this town.
Posted 7 months ago # -
Walker
The KLD / Downtown
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wynnie said:I strongly disagree with the transit center AND idea that all non-High Street buses should be taken off of High Street. Many buses like the #5, 7, and 8 also serve the Short North. If you take all other buses off of High Street, the #2 will likely need to run additional buses... and they will go up and down High Street.
I didn't say anything about removing the 5, 7 or 8 from High since those continue to serve high well up into the Short North and beyond. The buses I mentioned removing (and COTA seems to have agreed with some of them) really don't need to be on High at all: Routes 1, 3, 4, 6, 9, 11, 14, 15, 16(north), 18 and 19 could all be shifted to Front Street. Same with many express routes.
wynnie said:Whatever happened to the idea that the city was going to connect all of the downtown communities via public transit/trolley/street car? Has that idea of neighborhood continuation gone out the window?
Yep. The Streetcar was shelved awhile back, unfortunately.
wynnie said:1)I work downtown in an office building on High Street. Often, I work late. When it gets dark outside, I don't want to stray off of High Street because it is generally well lit. Side streets are dark. Additionally, traffic on 3rd and 4th streets move pretty fast and drivers are generally not very aware of pedestrians... especially at night and when the sun sets early in the fall and winter.
COTA's proposal on the table right now is to shift buses to Front Street and convert it to two-way. Front is well lit, traffic is less speedy, and you could easily access it from major streets (Broad, Gay, Long, etc).
Posted 7 months ago # -
johnwirtz
Evanston, IL
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My thoughts here:
http://xingcolumbus.wordpress.com/2011/07/20/cota-downtown-operations-analysis/Basically, I think they need to think about how to meet the ultimate goal. If the goal is to revitalize High Street, and we're going to spend $1.2 million or more annually to do it in perpetuity (I'm not even counting capital costs), is relocating 36% of the High Street buses and 25% of the transit riders to Front Street the most effective way to accomplish the goal? Can you think of anything else you could do with that sum of money that would be more effective at revitalizing High Street?
Posted 7 months ago # -
cc
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I think that spreading the routes over several streets will actually help business. The COTA riders are potential customers who will walk and ride past possible business locations. The problem now is one of oversaturation (the infamous wall of busses) to a point that it may actually be squeezing out business by removing line of sight, possible on street parking and detracting from the enjoyment of the urban environment.
Posted 7 months ago # -
johnwirtz
Evanston, IL
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I just think it's extremely speculative. It might work. It might not. I think we could just use that money (if it actually existed anywhere other than in COTA's budget) to give out grants to start businesses and it would be a more direct way of getting stores on the street.
Posted 7 months ago # -
cc
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I do not know. I think they once talked about similar things concerning business start ups at City Center Mall as it was dying. I think the best way to plant a garden is to insure it has rich soil to grow in. You can water it all you want, but the nutrients have to be there.
Posted 7 months ago # -
heresthecasey
OSU
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cc said:
I do not know. I think they once talked about similar things concerning business start ups at City Center Mall as it was dying. I think the best way to plant a garden is to insure it has rich soil to grow in. You can water it all you want, but the nutrients have to be there.One of the biggest missed opportunities I can think of was the failure to help relocate some of the last-surviving businesses from City Center out onto High Street, or to elsewhere in Downtown when the mall closed. A lot of these were small, local shops or franchises that somehow were still able to make it, even in a very inhospitable retail environment. They clung to life against the odds in a dead mall, which if it was open today I could easily see them still doing.
I imagine they were profitable enough to stay open but weren't able to, by themselves, make the investments necessary to move out to a new space on the street. If Capital Crossroads or the CDDC had the foresight to assist successful businesses already downtown at the time, when the writing was very clearly on the wall, it could have alleviated some of the struggles that their retail recruitment program for the "Mile on High" is now presumably having. Just my two cents...
eta: The one successful relocate I can think of is T.Bears Florist now in the CC parking garage. Not sure if they were helped in the move by anyone, but kudos to them for escaping the mall's third floor and being a valuable addition to downtown.
Posted 7 months ago # -
bldng4jstc
Downtown
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Last two meetings on the ideas to re-route buses Downtown are Today at 12pm & 6pm at the COTA Admin Offices (33 N High St). Presentation can be found on the linked page.
Posted 7 months ago # -
bldng4jstc
Downtown
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*WARNING - LONG POST*
Sorry for the long post, but this is something that I feel rather passionate about.
I was able to attend the 6pm meeting on 7/26 to discuss the options COTA's downtown service. (Presentation)Please visit John's post on his blog Xing Columbus for an understanding of the proposed changes.
In the end, everyone in the room agreed both ideas are terrible. The Front St. re-route leaves way too many buses on High St. for it to act like the Short North and the transit center is costly, adds too much time to all of the routes, and will only add parking on the East side of High st. The riders in the room did not care about air conditioning, coffee shops, or having a single place to transfer as suggested by the Mayor. All did understand the concerns of the property owners but felt these plans simply were to hide transit riders without adding any real benefits to service. One Non-COTA rider but taxpayer stated that their were simpler solutions while another young man felt all the ideas suggested lacked any real ingenuity. Ideas of using underutilized space on Broad or lining buses between State & Broad were common themes. Concerns were also stated for the disabled and how the actual businesses (Not Building Owners) are not involved. Also noted was that with all the unused storefronts should be turned into a transit center since no one wants them. (I mean we tore down a lot more for surface parking...)
The coarse of the meeting made me realize that the analysis is truly lacking purpose. 'Get buses off High St' is not a real constraint. Does the plan want to add parking, move the 'Wall of Buses', or move the bus riders. Each of these items could be accomplished in different ways, but the analysis shows that all three are not possible given the constraint of keeping all traffic capacity.
The Mayor, CDDC, and Property Owners IMO are simply disconnected and are missing a great opportunity to market the area. High St cannot compete with Polaris and shouldn't. High St. is downtown, is a transit area, and should act like it. Instead of hiding transit, perhaps center of the road service, bus lanes, route branding, and a more complete street should be enacted. Expand on the efforts of Barrio, Brioso, Spinelli's, etc. by making the area where people who enjoy urban areas will go to by car, bus, bike, or foot. The area has parking, but people don't know, feel it's too expensive, or are confused by poorly communicated rules/enforcement.
I equally blame COTA for not stepping up for their customers and demanding better infrastructure for better service. What are they doing to improve driver changes? What about light priority? Unfortunately COTA is planning on improving all the bus shelters in the area - including the statehouse - but that does nothing for service nor improve COTA's image of usefulness to the downtown community. Give this city real bus transit or tweak the current status quo. Stop chasing suburban commuters, and make it so that every OSU Student or GV resident prefers to travel down/up High on COTA because it is less of a hassle and reliable. The funny party is that COTA is installing fare boxes that track transfers so all this may change with route changes in the future. Real time tracking is coming but they are having 'vendor issues'. We will wait and see what the board of directors has to say. Hopefully common sense will prevail...
Posted 6 months ago # -
bldng4jstc
Downtown
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Walker said:
Thanks for the update from the meeting and for sharing your thoughts on this. Interesting stuff. ;)Massive fail at being concise, but the details needed to go somewhere. Its on record for when someone starts a thread about how the city should do something about the buses.
Posted 6 months ago #
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