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YouTubeAn interesting article appeared in this morning's Dispatch concerning the continuing financial woes of the Columbus Symphony which began well before the current recession. The musicians are being asked to take another pay cut on top of the previous 25% pay cut. Donors are being asked to give more. Will the Chamber of Commerce, county and city rally behind the Columbus Symphony to save them as they have for the Columbus Blue Jackets? Will public assistance be provided to the Columbus Symphony and other struggling art groups as is being proposed for the Columbus Blue Jackets? Will the Columbus Blue Jackets players be asked to take pay cuts as were the Columbus Symphony musicians?
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Columbus Symphony or Blue Jackets
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Brant
Gahanna
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You raise a pretty compelling issue, notably the fact that both the performing arts and major league sports have, in recent years, become unlikely partners under the same "creative economy" umbrella.
While performing arts operate as non-profit businesses and major league sports operate as for-profit businesses, both institutions are using the same arguments to justify public support: we're too big to fail, the city's national image would collapse, we would lose hundreds (if not thousands) of related jobs, we're a symbol of civic pride, etc.
I think what we're seeing is a convergence of business models to reflect the common "travel and tourism" draw of both the CSO and CBJ. So we'll continue to see the CSO operating with reduced government subsidies and a leaner payroll (more like a for-profit), and the CBJ operating with increased government subsidies (more like a non-profit).
The big question is whether the CSO musicians can stomach the thought of being treated more like for-profit employees, and whether taxpayers can stomach the thought of the CBJ being treated more like a cultural institution.
Posted 2 years ago # -
sixby9is42
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Some of the Dispatch comments in the initial write up of the story were actually worth reading: one commenter suggested combining the Cincinnati, Columbus and Cleveland symphonies into one, and have them travel around. Each city gets fewer concerts, but that could translate into more people going to each concert. That means some people are out of a job, but performing (classical) music as a career comes with major risk these days. I hope it doesn't come to this, but it's better than nothing, I suppose.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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I strongly suspect the union's collective bargain agreement would prevent a single NHL team's players from taking a paycut.
In previous threads, I have stated what I think the CSO and orchestras in general need to do. In short, I think the CSO needs to die completely and then rebuild in new and sustainable ways.
A.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Brant
Gahanna
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sixby9is42 wrote >>
Some of the Dispatch comments in the initial write up of the story were actually worth reading: one commenter suggested combining the Cincinnati, Columbus and Cleveland symphonies into one, and have them travel around.And what if the CBJ were to split their time between Cleveland, Cincy and Columbus, playing 14 home games a year in each city? After all, the logo on their chest indicates that the team represents all of Ohio...
Posted 2 years ago # -
agtw31
columbus
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Brant Jones wrote >>
I think what we're seeing is a convergence of business models to reflect the common "travel and tourism" draw of both the CSO and CBJ. So we'll continue to see the CSO operating with reduced government subsidies and a leaner payroll (more like a for-profit), and the CBJ operating with increased government subsidies (more like a non-profit).
i can't feel sorry for the CSO.
if you're a musician,and you want to make money,go start a friggin trans ohio orchestra,and bring the Moody Blues in once a month.
CBJ with increased govt.subsidies?
i fail to understand the reliance on the govt. to keep a for profit sports team alive,while you have children in this state dropping out of high school like crazy,and a state education system in shambles.
wtf happened to priorities?
is "travel and tourism" more important than a child's future?
this is a prime example of self serving elites downtown trying to get a free ride off the average taxpayer.
Mike Coleman's very noticeable absence on this issue is a good sign this is a hot potato he should stay away from.
but maybe he'll say something a week after the Bluejackets get bought.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Analogue Kid
5th by West-Northwest
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sixby9is42 wrote >>
Some of the Dispatch comments in the initial write up of the story were actually worth reading: one commenter suggested combining the Cincinnati, Columbus and Cleveland symphonies into one, and have them travel around. Each city gets fewer concerts, but that could translate into more people going to each concert. That means some people are out of a job, but performing (classical) music as a career comes with major risk these days. I hope it doesn't come to this, but it's better than nothing, I suppose.That's an interesting idea, but what do we call the group? The Cincinnati Symphony is truly world renowned (as is the Cleveland Orchestra), and I can't see them giving up their name recognition to become the "Ohio Symphony".
Even if the Columbus Symphony goes away and the Cincinnati Symphony spends half their time here, the average person would probably say that Columbus didn't actually have an Orchestra.
Now I think the Blue Jackets should absolutely play a few games in the US Bank and Quicken Loans Arenas. And when are we going to have the NFL "Battle of Ohio" played on neutral ground at Ohio Stadium? It's a guaranteed sellout.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Analogue Kid
5th by West-Northwest
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groundrules
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gk wrote >>
Will the Chamber of Commerce, county and city rally behind the Columbus Symphony to save them as they have for the Columbus Blue Jackets? Will public assistance be provided to the Columbus Symphony and other struggling art groups as is being proposed for the Columbus Blue Jackets? Will the Columbus Blue Jackets players be asked to take pay cuts as were the Columbus Symphony musicians?In my right hand I have two apples. In my left hand I have two oranges. Which is better?
Posted 2 years ago # -
gk
columbus, ohio
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Andrew Hall wrote >>
I strongly suspect the union's collective bargain agreement would prevent a single NHL team's players from taking a paycut.
In previous threads, I have stated what I think the CSO and orchestras in general need to do. In short, I think the CSO needs to die completely and then rebuild in new and sustainable ways.
A.When it comes to the financial solvency of an organization, collective bargaining agreements are routinely set aside or renegotiated for concessions.
Posted 2 years ago # -
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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gk wrote >>
Andrew Hall wrote >>
I strongly suspect the union's collective bargain agreement would prevent a single NHL team's players from taking a paycut.
In previous threads, I have stated what I think the CSO and orchestras in general need to do. In short, I think the CSO needs to die completely and then rebuild in new and sustainable ways.
A.When it comes to the financial solvency of an organization, collective bargaining agreements are routinely set aside or renegotiated for concessions.
Is the NHL itself approaching insolvency? The collective bargaining agreement is between the NHL and the players, not team-by-team. Individual contracts could be renegotiated with a team, but that would assume the players care more about staying in Columbus than their salaries. If a franchise is in fiscal trouble, it makes more sense for the league to move it.
A.
Posted 2 years ago # -
BCNation
Franklin Park
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If this thread means having to choose between which of the two to save, I'm all for culture and the arts and stuff, but we need to save the Blue Jackets, no matter how bad they currently are playing. The Arena District was BUILT solely for the survival of the Blue Jackets. If the Blue Jackets leave for the Indianapolises, Clevelands, Cincinnatis, Houstons, Louisvilles, Winnipegs, Saskatchewans, Hartfords, or KCs of the world, the Arena District will basically die, and that will look really bad for the revitalization (and future) of Downtown Columbus as a whole....and then after we save the CBJ's, the Symphony is next.
Posted 2 years ago # -
PunkRockSean
Beechwold
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Andrew Hall wrote >>
I strongly suspect the union's collective bargain agreement would prevent a single NHL team's players from taking a paycut.
In previous threads, I have stated what I think the CSO and orchestras in general need to do. In short, I think the CSO needs to die completely and then rebuild in new and sustainable ways.
A.Geez, I can't believe I missed this thread three days ago, especially since I actually read that Dispatch article.
Andrew, what on earth do you know about the NHL CBA? In fact, the NHL's CBA stipulates that if league revenue declines, players don't receive their full salaries in proportion to that decline. We're in a recession. Last year, league players took a pay cut of around 4 - 6% and this year they're going to take a larger cut. Their CBA doesn't protect them as you suspect.
With regards to the CSO and orchestras in general, could you explain why you think any organization "needs to die completely"? I don't wish that on anyone. We're talking about their jobs, here. The CSO players have already given back much of what they are worth in order to see that the orchestra stays together. Do you have any specifics as to what they could do to be more sustainable when they return?
Here's what I enjoyed most about the Dispatch's article, "Individual ticket sales are as high as they have been since 2002." The article makes it clear that declining corporate sponsorship is their biggest hurt right now. Their patrons don't want them to die completely, so why would you?
Posted 2 years ago # -
Andrew Hall
Dennison Place (The Circles)
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@PunkRockSean
Read what I wrote and that you quote - I was talking about a single team mandating a pay cut (as proposed by the thread opener) which I suspect is against the CBA. CBJ's financial woes are separate (and in many ways unique with respect to their financial relationship with Nationwide Arena) than the NHL's overall woes.
What I think needs to happen to revitalize classic music in general and the CSO specifically I have written in several past threads.
A.
Posted 2 years ago #
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