http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction ColumbusUnderground.com Messageboard en-US Sun, 12 Feb 2012 16:41:42 +0000 http://bbpress.org/?v=1.0.2 q http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/search.php http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-267203 Thu, 21 Jan 2010 14:45:30 +0000 JackieC 267203@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>Thought this made several good points, some even mentioned before on here. Hope you enjoy. </p> <p>"To create jobs, build public transit, not roads."- from Wired.com</p> <p><a href="http://www.wired.com/autopia/2010/01/jobs-for-main-street-act/" rel="nofollow">http://www.wired.com/autopia/2010/01/jobs-for-main-street-act/</a> </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218182 Mon, 20 Jul 2009 12:09:50 +0000 Rockmastermike 218182@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>misskitty wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218118"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> Why do people say that the highways cost us X amount of dollars and the Light rail will only cost this X amount of dollars ? I mean the highways are not going anywhere the bridges need fixed unless you want to see one crumble at random. So really adding rail is an additional cost it’s more because were not going to get rid of roads. Not that it’s a bad thing it just seemed like people assumed that once we have rail we wont have road cost.</p></blockquote> <p>road maintenance costs are cost by lane-mile. Fewer lanes added because rail systems take up some capacity = fewer lane-miles = lower maintenance cost.</p> <p>factor in freight rail and take trucks off the road and you run into serious savings, because trucks produce most of the 'wear and tear'. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218118 Mon, 20 Jul 2009 08:29:03 +0000 misskitty 218118@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>Why do people say that the highways cost us X amount of dollars and the Light rail will only cost this X amount of dollars ? I mean the highways are not going anywhere the bridges need fixed unless you want to see one crumble at random. So really adding rail is an additional cost it’s more because were not going to get rid of roads. Not that it’s a bad thing it just seemed like people assumed that once we have rail we wont have road cost. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218100 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 23:53:15 +0000 foxforcefive 218100@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>My head hurts from reading all 13 pages of this...that's 20 minutes that I'll never get back.</p> <p>On that note, I would use a light rail system. Heck, I would use COTA if they would run a line around the north-side of 270. For the mundane task of driving to work and back, I hate driving. </p> <p>My dad lives in Illinois, near St. Louis. He can catch a train not far from his house, and take it all the way downtown to watch a Cards game, visit the Arch, go to work, etc. One night after a game, we saw a drunk guy on the train that had puked and passed out in the doorway, which delayed the train from leaving on time...it was the after-game entertainment.</p> <p>I have to agree with the majority of sane posts in this thread. I think light-rail would only do good things for the economy and business as a whole, and would probably be paid for with increased tax revenue in a pretty short time. Furthermore, more people on the train = less people on the roads = potentially less traffic = win for the drivers...why are you complaining? </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218080 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 18:53:22 +0000 lifeontwowheels 218080@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>They run a bus during the season. A good place to start would be to look at the numbers for that route. </p> <p>A better idea would be a rail line eventually serving Dublin-Downtown and the general NW Columbus area. Linking rail to one specific destination is probably not a good idea for the long term. You could run a shuttle from a Dublin station to the zoo though. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218078 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 18:43:25 +0000 byJody 218078@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>jodyNcolumbus wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-217983"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> There are tracks going right by Downtown Powell... </p></blockquote> <p>..This would blend nicely with a link to the zoo/waterpark nearby. I think a combination of bike lending, taxi service and shuttle bus could complete the circuit. </p> <p>Who could use a train from downtown Columbus to the zoo?<br /> * Families who'd skip the hassle of driving/parking<br /> * Anyone who does not drive: Teens; Seniors;<br /> * Childcare professionals/field trips </p> <p>Something to think about. Hopefully this is on one of the rail lists somewhere. </p> <p>(Sorry - this seems off topic for how this thread is evolving. Maybe there is a better place to post 'the zoo train') </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218069 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 17:11:46 +0000 lifeontwowheels 218069@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>aderwent wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218068"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>surber17 wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218067"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> example - about 2 summers ago, within a 6 - 8 month period my average fill-up went from $24 to around $55. Because of high prices demand dropped and so did the price; but the real issue is the supply stayed the same (well actually just continued to drop). If something were to happen to that supply (either it goes away entirely, or people refuse to sell to America, etc.) we are screwed. People have spread out so much that they have given themselves no option to get to work other than drive there and because of the quick jump in price people may not be able to afford the commute everyday like they use to. Not getting to work ='s people losing their job ='s suffering of a very large group of people for a very long time. And this all could happen very very quickly because of our dependence on oil.<br /> People on here want one thing - options. Right now there are few to none for a lot of people; and the problem with pure capitalism is there won't be any options until it is too late because pure capitalism is reactionary by definition; where what we need right now is a preventative system.</p></blockquote> <p>people wouldn't be dependent on oil if the highway system were never created. sprawl is related absolutely directly to outerbelts and thru way highways. also, supply of oil is manipulated, just for your information. it's not related 100% to demand.<br /> as for "reactionary"; that's what the government is. how long have we been wanting rail? 10, 15 years? yet bureaucratic red tape has prevented it from happening. the private sector would have had the rail built long ago.</p></blockquote> <p>On the flip side there is that whole pesky argument about private industry gutting the existing transit infrastructure some years back. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218068 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 17:07:15 +0000 aderwent 218068@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>surber17 wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218067"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> example - about 2 summers ago, within a 6 - 8 month period my average fill-up went from $24 to around $55. Because of high prices demand dropped and so did the price; but the real issue is the supply stayed the same (well actually just continued to drop). If something were to happen to that supply (either it goes away entirely, or people refuse to sell to America, etc.) we are screwed. People have spread out so much that they have given themselves no option to get to work other than drive there and because of the quick jump in price people may not be able to afford the commute everyday like they use to. Not getting to work ='s people losing their job ='s suffering of a very large group of people for a very long time. And this all could happen very very quickly because of our dependence on oil.<br /> People on here want one thing - options. Right now there are few to none for a lot of people; and the problem with pure capitalism is there won't be any options until it is too late because pure capitalism is reactionary by definition; where what we need right now is a preventative system.</p></blockquote> <p>people wouldn't be dependent on oil if the highway system were never created. sprawl is related absolutely directly to outerbelts and thru way highways. also, supply of oil is manipulated, just for your information. it's not related 100% to demand.</p> <p>as for "reactionary"; that's what the government is. how long have we been wanting rail? 10, 15 years? yet bureaucratic red tape has prevented it from happening. the private sector would have had the rail built long ago. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218067 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:56:44 +0000 surber17 218067@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>example - about 2 summers ago, within a 6 - 8 month period my average fill-up went from $24 to around $55. Because of high prices demand dropped and so did the price; but the real issue is the supply stayed the same (well actually just continued to drop). If something were to happen to that supply (either it goes away entirely, or people refuse to sell to America, etc.) we are screwed. People have spread out so much that they have given themselves no option to get to work other than drive there and because of the quick jump in price people may not be able to afford the commute everyday like they use to. Not getting to work ='s people losing their job ='s suffering of a very large group of people for a very long time. And this all could happen very very quickly because of our dependence on oil. </p> <p>People on here want one thing - options. Right now there are few to none for a lot of people; and the problem with pure capitalism is there won't be any options until it is too late because pure capitalism is reactionary by definition; where what we need right now is a preventative system. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218063 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:36:11 +0000 aderwent 218063@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>lifeontwowheels wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218060"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> So how do you operate a city road without taxes or subsidies?</p></blockquote> <p>city roads, you can't. i thought you meant private rail, plane, or highway. i don't believe in a taxless government, just a tax less government. most if not all funds for the federal government should come from tariffs (like they did until the late 1800's [civil war, main reason, read further, haha]). cities should tax property, not income, for needy services (roads, again, not highways, police, fire, sewer, etc). </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218060 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:30:19 +0000 lifeontwowheels 218060@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>So how do you operate a city road without taxes or subsidies? </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218059 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:29:19 +0000 aderwent 218059@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>lifeontwowheels wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218055"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>aderwent wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218043"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>Core_Models wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218042"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> If you're under the impression that owning a toll road would somehow be a profitable endeavor for a business, you really should spend a little time with some numbers.</p></blockquote> <p>yeah, government numbers. and your point is exactly why there wouldn't be many highways. demand would be low due to tolls (even though people don't even think about how much of their money is taken through taxes for highways), and therefore, fewer highways. people would go with the cheaper means. whether that was biking, driving on city roads, walking or riding a train.</p></blockquote> <p>Even if they are cheaper, those options require government control, taxes and subsidies. Which you seem to be against. Care to clarify?</p></blockquote> <p>why would they require those? the economy should be run by supply and demand for the most part. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218058 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:27:40 +0000 aderwent 218058@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>surber17 wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218052"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>aderwent wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218043"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>Core_Models wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218042"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> If you're under the impression that owning a toll road would somehow be a profitable endeavor for a business, you really should spend a little time with some numbers.</p></blockquote> <p>yeah, government numbers. and your point is exactly why there wouldn't be many highways. demand would be low due to tolls (even though people don't even think about how much of their money is taken through taxes for highways), and therefore, fewer highways. people would go with the cheaper means. whether that was biking, driving on city roads, walking or riding a train.</p></blockquote> <p>I do see where you're coming from and I do like the idea of everyone just living in a more dense society instead of spreading out and taking over everything. Here is my problem with pure capitalism though .... by the time a need arises, sometimes it is too late and a large group of people are going to have to suffer for a very long time.</p></blockquote> <p>thank you for rationality. i have to ask about the "need" part, though.</p> <p>i'm not anarchist, or even adam smith. i advocate not pure capitalism, but pretty close (government should be allowed to terminate monopolies, run fire, police, roads (not highways), etc). </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218056 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:24:04 +0000 aderwent 218056@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>surber17 wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218048"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>aderwent wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218040"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>surber17 wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218013"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> @aderwent .... so you don't think transportation should be a government function? Without the government there is no way we would have a road system at all. I really don't see how transportation correlates to socialism.</p></blockquote> <p>hmm... i've said nothing except highways (and rail and air travel). </p></blockquote> <p>Air, rail, and car .... what other forms of transportation are there? I can't think of many, so I don't think I twisted your words at all.</p></blockquote> <p>you said i advocated the privatization of all roads. just saying that's not true. by the way, no hard feelings here, sorry if i sound harsh or whatever :/ just advocating my position of anti-government lol. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218055 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:22:10 +0000 lifeontwowheels 218055@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>aderwent wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218043"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>Core_Models wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218042"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> If you're under the impression that owning a toll road would somehow be a profitable endeavor for a business, you really should spend a little time with some numbers.</p></blockquote> <p>yeah, government numbers. and your point is exactly why there wouldn't be many highways. demand would be low due to tolls (even though people don't even think about how much of their money is taken through taxes for highways), and therefore, fewer highways. people would go with the cheaper means. whether that was biking, driving on city roads, walking or riding a train.</p></blockquote> <p>Even if they are cheaper, those options require government control, taxes and subsidies. Which you seem to be against. Care to clarify? </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218054 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:21:56 +0000 aderwent 218054@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>Core_Models wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218045"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> Except for the whole transportation industry, getting goods to market, etc. etc. etc....but hey, why think that far ahead, its only the complete collapse of the economy...</p></blockquote> <p>i'm not advocating the destruction of the transportation industry... try to keep up.</p> <p>lolz. the complete collapse of the economy will come in about a 1-2 year period. hope you're ready for hyperinflation, super unemployment and raging crime. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/13#post-218052 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:17:26 +0000 surber17 218052@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>aderwent wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218043"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>Core_Models wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218042"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> If you're under the impression that owning a toll road would somehow be a profitable endeavor for a business, you really should spend a little time with some numbers.</p></blockquote> <p>yeah, government numbers. and your point is exactly why there wouldn't be many highways. demand would be low due to tolls (even though people don't even think about how much of their money is taken through taxes for highways), and therefore, fewer highways. people would go with the cheaper means. whether that was biking, driving on city roads, walking or riding a train.</p></blockquote> <p>I do see where you're coming from and I do like the idea of everyone just living in a more dense society instead of spreading out and taking over everything. Here is my problem with pure capitalism though .... by the time a need arises, sometimes it is too late and a large group of people are going to have to suffer for a very long time. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218050 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:14:50 +0000 Core_Models 218050@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>If Enzo posted in political threads, it would be a lot like this. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218048 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:13:08 +0000 surber17 218048@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <blockquote><p><cite>aderwent wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218040"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite></p> <blockquote><p><cite>surber17 wrote <a href="http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218013"> &gt;&gt; </a></cite><br /> @aderwent .... so you don't think transportation should be a government function? Without the government there is no way we would have a road system at all. I really don't see how transportation correlates to socialism.</p></blockquote> <p>hmm... i've said nothing except highways (and rail and air travel). </p></blockquote> <p>Air, rail, and car .... what other forms of transportation are there? I can't think of many, so I don't think I twisted your words at all. </p> http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/topic/a-dispatch-letter-to-the-editor-about-rt-315-construction/page/12#post-218045 Sun, 19 Jul 2009 16:09:00 +0000 Core_Models 218045@http://www.columbusunderground.com/forums/ <p>Except for the whole transportation industry, getting goods to market, etc. etc. etc....but hey, why think that far ahead, its only the complete collapse of the economy... </p>