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In this week’s podcast we sit down with Jon Myers and Chuck Hootman, founders of Casino-Free Columbus, the local grassroots effort to halt the development of the casino in the Arena District. Jon & Chuck tell us about how this movement came about, why the casino is not a good fit for our community, what types of development we need to be striving for instead and ways for others to get involved. More information can be found on their twitter profile @casinofreecolo and their Facebook page – “CasinoFreColumbus“.
You can use the player below to listen to the podcast, click here to download an mp3, click here to subscribe via iTunes, or click here to subscribe to the rss feed.
[audio:http://blip.tv/file/get/ColumbusUnderground-CUPodcast33CasinoFreeColumbus457.mp3]
A casino as a jobs and development tool seems like a classic, desperate small town move. Columbus doesn’t have to be desperate.
Urbanboi : “I also see the city as sort of having a small town feel that lives for OSU Buckeyes..like I said before ANY development would be a boost for downtown.”
Just on the surface, that is totally silly. A trash-burning power plant is development as would be a copper mine. Neither are appropriate for an urban center.
The question is not just whether a type of development is outright detrimental (like the above), but whether something like a casino that even if not totally negative, is negative by what is NOT done. Whether the casino drives away other development (it will), it will also provide far less than the already-progressing alternatives in that area. ANY development is not good in an absolute sense. Objectively speaking, we are not in such dire straits that we should grasp at anything.
I find it very depressing how much CMH self-loathing is evidenced here. We might reasonably disagree about the best course of action for the city, but reason isn’t possible if you are oblivious to what is around you. If all you see is Buckeye-mania, that is definitely a YOU problem, not a CMH one.
A.
@JonMyers, I can empathize wit where you’re coming from but you’re way off base on a number of points. I can certainly understand why Core has the complaints he does about your approach.
1. Not that this is fundamental to the issue, but dismissing routine activities theory as a “theory” is analogous to dismissing the theories of relativity, evolution, or gravity for being the same. These are testable paradigms and unless you’re prepared to offer evidence to the contrary to that offered by Coremodels, your dismissal that it’s “just a theory” won’t do you any good.
2. My biggest complaint is with how you’re going about this; I cannot fathom that someone who has evidence (or believes that he does) of political collusion and corruption believes the result of said collusion/corruption trumps the collusion and corruption themselves.
“I honestly believe there was a large amount of political corruption and position collusion on ALL sides that contributed to the passage of Issue 3. That collusion led to personal financial gain for interested parties. That would be considered corrupt by most people.
I’ve been following the money, following the decisions and privy to private conversations that have lead me to that conclusion. It makes no sense to go public with the specifics because exposing that corruption is not our goal. The goal is to stop a casino from being built.”
What? Please tell me I’m misinterpreting your words. Corruption IS the problem. You have an obligation to bring your evidence to the light of day. Merely focusing on the progeny of this alleged corruption is missing the forest for the trees. Your stated goals and priorities are wrong, and you deservedly won’t get anywhere if you continue on this tack.
I pick my battles. There will always be corruption. Especially when powerful financial interests are involved. Corruption is almost ALWAYS the problem. Are you really that naive?
The moment we go on a political corruption crusade is the moment they’ll start building a casino and we take a deep dive into a black hole of endless pursuit. The allegations would radicalize our effort. It’s not worth it. Sorry.
You have the same opportunity to explore the corruption and research it. If that’s your thing make it your mission dude. Democracy isn’t a spectator sport. Get busy.
We were handed a bad deal. I don’t want a casino built. 58% of Central Ohio voters don’t either. I’d rather be effective and get something done than “right”. I feel like we have a shot at getting something done.
No I’m not that naive. I don’t understand why someone who claims to have evidence of malfeasance is instead wasting his time fighting strawmen,
Don’t try to dump this in my lap. Whether you like it or not, you spoke up, you took charge, and you cultivated an audience for this issue; these are the consequences of leadership. If you actually have evidence, it is your obligation to do something about it. My interest and knowledge about this issue are pretty much what I’ve gleamed from reading here. Nothing more than an intrigued observer.
Since when are being right and effective exclusive things?
For someone who clearly thinks that things aren’t preordained, you certainly are following the line on whatever theoretical future construct you’ve created. You believe that just because the amendment passed doesn’t mean that the casino in Columbus is going to be built. Why will construction start the moment you go on a corruption crusade?
We aren’t. And we don’t have to be at this point. But if we let Penn National get away with imposing themselves upon us and dictating their terms of business to us, we might as well be Cleveland, Toledo or Detroit, because we will then have effectively surrendered our vision and control over our own destiny as a city and also have opened the door to additional abuse and disrespect.
Whether casino proponents agree with this or not, perception means a great deal. Many people have bought (literally) into Mayor Coleman’s vision of life and living in the heart of this city. They see a casino as posing a direct threat to this vision, and if not convinced otherwise, will speak with their pocketbooks and withdraw themselves and their investments from Downtown. We can argue casino-influenced crime stats until the Sun goes “Red Giant” and nukes this planet in another 5 billion years. The important point here and now is that a significant number of existing Downtown Columbus residents have expressed their opposition and dismay at the idea of having a casino as their neighbor. If we lose them because of Penn National and a shitty hack to our state constitution, we are losing 15 years of progress that has greatly benefitted our city and set it apart from so many others in the Midwest.
I don’t think Penn National is worth that kind of sacrifice… Do you?
@Brent – I spoke up and am helping with an effort to stop a casino from being built. Consequences of leadership my ass. There are 1,500 other people who are leaders who have signed up to stop it from being built. I’m staying focused on that mission. Stop a casino from being built in Columbus. These people didn’t sign up for a political corruption crusade.
Regarding corruption, I’m not cultivating evidence for shit. I described how I arrived at a personal opinion that corruption was involved. You can take it or leave and that’s really the end of it.
A conversation is not “evidence”. I don’t tape record people I know. It’s a conversation. Again, NOT evidence. Read what I said. I followed the “money trail” just like YOU have the opportunity to do. I followed the pattern of decision making just like YOU can do. Those combined with these “conversations” is what led me to believe there was corruption involved. The hearsay and whisper whisper that circulates may or may NOT be true. I realize that..
None the less, based on the money trail that YOU have access to and the decisions that YOU also have access to – Based solely on these I believe there was collusion and corruption.
A corruption expose is not the basis for my personal effort to stop the casino. I’m cynical I assume most politicians are corrupt. The question is how much.
Again, if it matters that much to you – DO the research and get your Joe America rollin’ dude. It’s all out there for everyone to see.
The problem as I see it Jon, is your repetitive insinuations and implications that corruption was involved carries a lot of weight with people who haven’t followed this closely or haven’t cared (read: me). Unless you’re willing to show your cards and call a spade a spade, it behooves you to stop bringing that up. You just stated that everything you’ve got is rumors and hearsay and doesn’t mean a damn thing. So why do you keep hanging your hat on that argument?
Brent – Why would an ordinary citizen’s word carry “a lot of weight”? I’m not a journalist, I’m not an investigative reporter. I’m an ordinary citizen with an opinion.
I’m not “behooved” to do a damn thing and I’m not “hanging my hat” on any argument. There is no argument to hang my hat on. Again, I have a personal opinion. Where’s the mystery?
DO THE RESEARCH. Form your own opinion. It’s not my responsibility to do the research for you and tell you what to think based on my personal opinions.
I worked for several elected officials fielding calls on all kinds of issues. The bottom line is that all of this ground swell of support and grassroots mobilization and pod casts and researching of money trails should have happened before the election. While there were certainly discussions going on here on CU and elsewhere, there didn’t seem to be any real action or effort. Its only now that the issue has passed that everyone gets fired up and wants to change the result.
I hope everyone involved in both sides of this discussion takes this as a lesson the next time around to education themselves and act before the time when it would actually make a difference. Now its just comes across as sour grapes rather than a proactive grassroots effort.
@dreamweaver646 – I’m guilty and couldn’t agree more. It should have happened before the election. It didn’t.
“The bottom line is that all of this ground swell of support and grassroots mobilization and pod casts and researching of money trails should have happened before the election.”
Better late than never.
Jon, I’m a bit of an exception in that I honestly don’t care. I’m not from central Ohio, I’m moving in a year, and I didn’t vote on the issue because of that.
All I hear from opponents is a lot of after-the-fact, we lost, NIMBY, crybaby bullshit. No evidence, no facts, nothing. Your allegations and insinuations were the first thing I saw that may have constituted a legitimate gripe. But you apparently cannot or are unwilling to back that up.
You’ve obviously done the research so why won’t you share? You’ve got a cause, you’re speaking out, giving interviews, formed an interest group, etc. Growing that necessitates sharing the information you’ve acquired to get support to your stated goal of preventing the casino from being built.
Stating your opinion (while implying you’ve got inside info) to folks while trying to convince them to agree with you is one thing. Responding with “Do it yourself” when they ask for details or justification is entirely something else.
You “honestly don’t care”, yet you’re investing your time here. Interesting investment of your time for someone “who hasn’t followed closely” to have an opinion and for someone who “doesn’t care”.
I hear and appreciate Core’s opinion, though I respectfully disagree.
You’re opinion.. Well, you “don’t care”. So why should anyone give a shit about what you say on the matter?
Hooray for circular/ad-hominem arguments! Here’s my timeline since apparently I haven’t made it clear.
I didn’t follow the issue from the get-go because I knew it was controversial and I knew I’d be moving. I didn’t vote on it because I knew I wouldn’t benefit/suffer from whatever the result.
I read The Other Paper article about your concerns and became intrigued. I read the posts and threads here that I’d previously ignored. I was not interested initially, I am now.
From reading the back and forth here, many people were opposed from the beginning for a variety of reasons. Post-election, much of that opposition has turned into crying, name-calling, and NIMBY bitching with little of a cogent argument to be found. Some posters, Andrew Hall in particular, have made excellent, rational arguments in opposition. You however, have become the “figurehead” of this thing whether you like it or not so I’ve directed my comments at you.
Many of your arguments have included hints or allegations of corruption outside of the usual grey area in politics. I’ve asked you repeatedly to state exactly what you know and what these things are. You have deferred, refused, and essentially been unable to do so. Now you’re resorting to personal attacks (not particularly mean ones fwiw, no biggie) but still haven’t shed any light on exactly what you’re getting at.
All I can conclude is that you missed your political window, are pissed and/or regretful, and now are bitching and moaning and trying to subvert the political will of the majority of Ohioans because your desired outcome lost.
Who is attacking you? You can throw ten more ten dollar words at it. You said you “don’t care”.. You’re the big shot who’s above all this because your moving. Yet, you’re investing your time in this conversation.
I don’t have to continue to explain myself to you pal.
Our goal is to stop the casino from being built. Allegations of political corruption are not the smoking gun to make that happen.
dreamweaver646 Says: While there were certainly discussions going on here on CU and elsewhere, there didn’t seem to be any real action or effort. Its only now that the issue has passed that everyone gets fired up and wants to change the result.
I think part of the problem is that this was a statewide vote on what I think a lot of people feel is really more of a local issue in four cities. No amount of banging the oppositional drum in Columbus was going to change how people felt in the far-flung counties throughout the state. Central Ohio voted no, so there wasn’t a whole lot of reason for the locals to get fired up when the local majority was against it to begin with. Now that it’s passed at the state level, I think it makes perfect sense for locals to take the proper legal/legislative/grassroots actions to retroactively block what the local majority doesn’t want.
I thought the great thing about our whole governmental process is that it always allows for change. If people want to start a movement and make some change, and the majority of the public is behind them, then what’s the problem?
Here is an Op-Ed by Ted Celeste…
Casinos’ attempt to skirt local zoning restrictions troubling
http://www.dispatch.com/live/content/editorials/stories/2009/11/29/celeste29.ART_ART_11-29-09_G5_A2FQOGV.html?sid=101
Mayor, council president serve voters by fighting casino in Arena District
Sunday, November 29, 2009
Penn National obtained an option to buy the Jaeger site from Plaza Properties, which only last year obtained a $750,000 state grant to demolish the factory and clean up the property, on a promise to build condominiums and retail outlets on the site. The Ohio Department of Development, on a recommendation from the city, awarded the Clean Ohio Assistance Fund grant to allow Plaza Properties to clean up pollution from more than 70 years of manufacturing.
Plaza Properties pledged to develop 243 condominiums, 15,000 square feet of retail space and a small park. After Penn National announced its plan to build a casino there instead, state and city officials said they could do nothing about the bait-and-switch.
READ MORE
1. I think this sounds like one of the more solid legal approaches to fighting this, or at least this location.
2. I’m not sure I get how this is a bad faith maneuver by Penn National. They didn’t make a pledge to develop condos there, get a grant to clean up the pollution there, etc. Once again, trying to portray Penn as the bad guy comes off a bit dubious. You want to take issue with Plaza Properties, do it…their behavior seems downright fraudulent.